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post #171 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-22-14, 11:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Kreuger View Post
Nope, I checked. They can't. Unless its a huge game I can't see 5 'brutes firing in unison as that useful. It seems like overkill, or wasted points.
5 Lascannon shots are about what you need to take out a AV 14 tank. But the point cost is a lot to sink into that 'death-star'
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post #172 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-23-14, 02:03 AM
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I haven't thought the whole thing through. A walker vehicle squadron Deathstar . . . It seems insane (pun intended).

But it might just work in a larger game PROVIDED the unit has targets. If they end up marooned in a corner they still have range, but probably not LOS.

Hmmm. With Las/missiles statistically they may kill about 90 points of marines or regular terminators a shooting phase. Which doesn't quite pay for them in a 4 or 5 turn game.

Or as you say, it could be a land raider for 250 points.

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post #173 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-24-14, 09:52 AM
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Is there any chance of a copy/paste or a brief description for the workblocked?
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post #174 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-24-14, 12:23 PM
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Is there any chance of a copy/paste or a brief description for the workblocked?
Here's the Meat and Potatoes of the article:
Quote:
Formation Rules

As mentioned before, there are 3 Formations in this book. We'll look at each of them and I'll share my initial impressions of them in turn.

Mayhem Pack

Do you want to Deep Strike Helbrutes into your enemy's lines and watch the chaos unfurl? Well then this is the Formation for you. Consisting of 3 Helbrutes this formation has the 3 following Special Rules:
  • It Will Not Die
  • Mayhem from the Maelstrom: All of the units in this Formation must begin the game in Reserve. When making Reserve Rolls, make a single roll for the entire Formation. On a successful Reserve Roll, all of the units in this Formation arrive from Reserve by Deep Strike.
  • Tormented Terrors: At the start of each of your Movement phases, make a single roll on the Crazed Table. All of the Helbrutes in this formation are affected by the result, even if they have not suffered a glancing or penetrating hit.
While more dangerous than the loyalist method of throwing Dreadnoughts near enemy lines this method is cheaper, doesn't use a Force Organizational Slot and gives It Will Not Die to the Helbrutes. All in all not a bad option for throwing them deep in the enemy lines. I'd likely load a formation like this with Multi-Meltas and Powerfists with Flamers just to ensure as much carnage as quickly as possible, but everyone has their own idea how to best sow terror with these guys I bet. Regardless they look like they could be a lot of fun to throw into the enemy lines and watch the mayhem unfurl.

Helcult


Do you like Cultists? Do you ever feel that those same Cultists could do more to protect other models in your army? Have you ever wanted to see them fling themselves in harm's way to protect other models? Then the Helcult has just the answer (and potential amusement) just for you! Consisting of a single Helbrute and 2 units of Cultist (of any size, but you may want to take large units for this one, you'll need the bodies) it comes with the following rules:
  • Apocalyptic Fury: This Formation's Helbrute has the Rage special rule. Futhermore, when rolling To Hit with the Helbrute's Melee attacks, any unmodified rolls of 1 are not discard. Instead, they automatically hit a friendly model (but not the Helbrute) nearby. Randomly determine (for each roll of a 1) which model is hit, from those in 6" of the Helbrute, even if they are not involved in the same combat. If there are no viable targets in range, these Attacks are discarded.
  • Living Idol of Chaos: As long as the Helbrute is alive, both of the Formation's units of Chaos Cultists have the fearless special rule. If the Helbrute is completely destroyed, the Formation's units of Chaos Cultists lose the Fearless special rule, but gain the Zealot special rule.
  • Human Shields: If the Helbrute is partially obscured from the firer's line of sight by models from one, or more of the Formation's units of Chaos Cultists, it receives a 3+ cover save. However, for each successful cover save the controlling player makes as a result of this special rule the nearest intervening Cultist model is removed as a casualty with no saves allowed.
When news of the formations first broke this was the formation that interested me the most, and I'm glad it to find out it's even more entertaining that I expected. With a Helbrute who acts like Kharn in close combat (with a bigger aura of killing!), Fearless Cultists who become Zealots if the Helbrute is killed (giving them Fearless and Hatred) and the Human Shields rule making it possible to bubble wrap the Helbrute and march him across the table this might be the most interesting (and possibly distracting) formation, especially if you take the maximum formation size with 70 Cultists running across the board!

Helfist Murderpack


Do you like large vehicle squadrons? Or do you wish that Helbrutes could be a little more predictable and controllable? Perhaps you have a lot of extra Helbrute models floating around because you bought a lot of Dark Vengeance sets. Well if any of this applies to you, this might be right up your alley! A formation consisting of five Helbrutes (yes, FIVE) the Helbrutes in this formation has a special restriction: one Helbrute must be nominated as the Helbrute Champion. In exchange the formation has the following special rules:
  • Murder Pack: All Helbrutes in this formation count as a single vehicle squadron.
  • Pack Leader: The Helbrute Champion has the Vehicle (character) unit type, and the Aura of Dark Glory Chaos reward. Other Helbrutes in the same vehicle unit can make Look Out, Sir attempts to protect the Helbrute Champion as long as they are within 6". Furthermore, if any of the Formation's Helbrutes have crazed markers, do not roll on the Crazed Table if the Helbrute Champion is still alive; instead the controlling player can choose which result affects them each turn, though the nominated result applies to all the Helbrutes in the formation with crazed markers.
  • Death of a Leader: If the Helbrute Champion is completely destroyed, all other Helbrutes in the Formation gain the Rage special rule.
This on strikes me as possibly the biggest surprise. Running at least 500 points this is a unit with a massive footprint, but an interesting set of rules as well. The Helbrute Champion was an interesting addition with both the Character rule as well as the 5++ invulnerable save and the ability to pick which Crazed Result the unit will use every turn. Regardless of how you build the unit it won't be cheap but it will be possibly the most distracting vehicle squadron you could field outside of Apocalypse or the Guard codex. I don't see a lot of people running this one, mostly because of the model count requirement, but I do see it being potentially entertaining as you throw 5 large based models on the table and challenge your opponent to try and kill them quickly.

Last edited by Zion; 03-24-14 at 12:25 PM.
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post #175 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-24-14, 03:17 PM
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Hmmm.... the last formation does sound nasty but overall it looks pretty fun with the formations on offer


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post #176 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-24-14, 03:45 PM
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Maybe I'm missing it, but I couldn't find it very clear which of the 3 formations take up a slot in the force org. Are they all external to the default setup?
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post #177 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-24-14, 03:55 PM
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Maybe I'm missing it, but I couldn't find it very clear which of the 3 formations take up a slot in the force org. Are they all external to the default setup?
This may help
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post #178 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-24-14, 04:00 PM
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Maybe I'm missing it, but I couldn't find it very clear which of the 3 formations take up a slot in the force org. Are they all external to the default setup?
Each formation counts as a detachment that comes from the C:CSM codex but does not use a FOC slot for the primary detachment, or allies, even if allied to another army.

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It doesn't cover the potentially infinite formation detachments you can have though.
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post #179 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-24-14, 04:10 PM
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Each formation counts as a detachment that comes from the C:CSM codex but does not use a FOC slot for the primary detachment, or allies, even if allied to another army.


It doesn't cover the potentially infinite formation detachments you can have though.
Yes it does, at the very bottom......
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post #180 of 193 (permalink) Old 03-24-14, 04:18 PM
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Just a couple of quick questions from someone who is now trying to figure out how the hell to get an e-book reader...on a windows phone, with awful signal and no internet for the next 15 days and who has not previously bought a dataslate...

Do the detachments have points values like in apoc of is it just the cost of the models?
Do troops bought as part of a detachment count as scoring?

I'm also hideously workblocked from most of the internet, so if anyone could answer a plain yes/no I'd really appreciate it
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