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post #421 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by LukeValantine View Post
Side note: Necron overlords are now one of the best bullet sponges for your army. It should only take around 85-100 bolter rounds before the enemy can hit my warriors. Then there is always the chance he will stand back up (This is assuming that you give him the 2+ save)
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post #422 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 09:37 PM
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Side note: Necron overlords are now one of the best bullet sponges for your army. It should only take around 85-100 bolter rounds before the enemy can hit my warriors. Then there is always the chance he will stand back up (This is assuming that you give him the 2+ save)
Indeed they are. Esecially if the unit has Chronometron-tek in it and the lord has a res orb. And if your opponent starts to las-cannon him to death you can just "Look out, sir!" all those nasty ap2 shots to the warriors.
Maybe Necrons is the new black....


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post #423 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 09:37 PM
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How many different saves are you likely to have in a single unit?

If an IC has joined a unit and he is at the front roll for him, when he dies roll everyone else's.
Depending on the incoming shots, and with battle brother allies... uh... 5? 6?

Example: BT crusader squad with initiates (3+) and neophytes (4+). Toss in the EC (doesn't count towards HQ units), a marshal in terminator armor (2+/5++) and another IC with a stormshield (3+/3++). Now toss in a Battle brother ally with yet another save configuration, and set up the unit with the ICs toward the front.

This is suddenly a mess.
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post #424 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 09:41 PM
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Good grief, way to try and overcomplicate a simple system.

From what I understand, any unit you roll saves. That many die, take from the front first regardless of equipment. Simple.

If you have something spangly at the front, which isn't going to happen often, like an IC or Exarch with an invulnerable, that's the only time you'd need to go one by one.

Though to be honest: space marine character with 3+ followed by 5+ for whatever reason, in a tactical squad. 10 wounds caused: 2 saves made. Roll addition spangly 5+ 8 times: 2 saves made. Hey presto, there's enough failed wounds for your 3 wound captain to die, and then the remaining kill 3 marines.

Doesn't seem too hard. Let's see how it's worded it the book, as that quoted post isn't direct from the book with that wording...

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post #425 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 09:51 PM
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Depending on the incoming shots, and with battle brother allies... uh... 5? 6?

Example: BT crusader squad with initiates (3+) and neophytes (4+). Toss in the EC (doesn't count towards HQ units), a marshal in terminator armor (2+/5++) and another IC with a stormshield (3+/3++). Now toss in a Battle brother ally with yet another save configuration, and set up the unit with the ICs toward the front.

This is suddenly a mess.
Not really. Assuming those blokes are at the front:

Pick one. Roll all saves vs his save. Any excess over what is needed to kill him gets rerolled vs the next blokes save. Carry on until you run out of dice or blokes. If multiple the same have the same save, take multiple off.

People are making this seem more complicated than it needs to be. Let's see how the wording is in the actual book before getting all het up. And as to the example above: if you don't want to have saves take forever, *don't build units like that*. 'tis your own fault

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post #426 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 10:08 PM
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Tabby has pretty much pegged it I think. Just roll all the saves at once and start counting the number of failed saves starting closest to the shooter. Just cause you've got some 3+ and 4+ guys wouldn't mean the 3+ guy could take 30 shots while the 4+ could take 10. It just makes it more realistic at the end of the day that the guys in the line of the hail of bullets are gonna get killed before the guys at the back.

Think about it... take 10 saves at 4+, say you average 6 saves.. so 4 wounds... in a 5 man squad you loose 4 of them. Add in the 3+ character and you make 7 saves, you only loose 2 guys and take a wound off the character. As said... more realisitc.
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post #427 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 10:17 PM
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Not really. Assuming those blokes are at the front:

Pick one. Roll all saves vs his save. Any excess over what is needed to kill him gets rerolled vs the next blokes save. Carry on until you run out of dice or blokes. If multiple the same have the same save, take multiple off.

People are making this seem more complicated than it needs to be. Let's see how the wording is in the actual book before getting all het up. And as to the example above: if you don't want to have saves take forever, *don't build units like that*. 'tis your own fault

Actually, I was just answering 'how many saves could you have in a single unit,' I wouldn't actually put together a unit like that.

But you're also oversimplifying a bit. If the 3+ and 4+ are alternated with each other (and the characters as well), you can't just take out batches, because 'closest' wouldn't be consistent, and you wouldn't know how many to remove until you've rolled the dice.

But basically, I think this new information from Faiet is inaccurate in some way. It doesn't really match up with earlier rumours, and it seems more problematic (in terms of time and exploiting the rules) than those initial rumours. We'll see how it actually is in a couple days.

Last edited by Voss; 06-27-12 at 10:22 PM.
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post #428 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 10:17 PM
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Tabby has pretty much pegged it I think. Just roll all the saves at once and start counting the number of failed saves starting closest to the shooter. Just cause you've got some 3+ and 4+ guys wouldn't mean the 3+ guy could take 30 shots while the 4+ could take 10. It just makes it more realistic...
That's the thing though, do you roll everything that guy failed or everything the next guy would have failed too if the first dies? I never said it was complicated, just wondered how they set it up. I mean why take a wound that the first guy would save? Rerolling sort of makes sense as it wouldn't just blast through the first automatically but it could possibly do that.

That's why I want to see the wording. Seems like it must be simple but there are a few ways to do that.
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post #429 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 10:30 PM
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That's the thing though, do you roll everything that guy failed or everything the next guy would have failed too if the first dies? I never said it was complicated, just wondered how they set it up. I mean why take a wound that the first guy would save? Rerolling sort of makes sense as it wouldn't just blast through the first automatically but it could possibly do that.

That's why I want to see the wording. Seems like it must be simple but there are a few ways to do that.

I understand where your comming from, but its just a fairer way of wound allocation. Instead of picking who died from failed saves, they're just taking out from the closest to the shooter first. You'd still have failed X many saves, its just who dies which has changed with the ruling.
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post #430 of 725 (permalink) Old 06-27-12, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by LukeValantine View Post
Side note: Necron overlords are now one of the best bullet sponges for your army. It should only take around 85-100 bolter rounds before the enemy can hit my warriors. Then there is always the chance he will stand back up (This is assuming that you give him the 2+ save)
Yes indeed. Throw him an a Court with 2 more Necron Lords with the same save and you have one very hard-to-kill unit.
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