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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-14-10, 05:06 AM Thread Starter
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2000pt BA Mech- Comp

Greeting s All!!

Itís been a while since I posted and played, so I figured I bight the bullet and put up the list Iím building. Iíve always been some-what of a tread head so I figured Iíd try my hand at the trendy old BA Mech list. Let me know what you think, thanks for lookingÖ

Headquarters

Libby w/TDA (Shield/Rage) - 125pts

Elites

5 Assault Termies w/2 Thammers and 3 LCs (Priest/Libby attached) - 210 pts
Dedicated Transport: LRC w/MM and EA 275pts

2 Sang Priests, one PW- 115pts

Troops

RAS x5 w/PF and Melta in AssCan Razorback (Priest w/PW attached)-195pts
RAS x5 w/PW and Melta in AssCan Razorback-185pts
RAS x5 w/PW and Melta in AssCan Razorback-185pts
RAS x5 w/PW and Melta in HB Razorback-150pts (not thrilled about this unit, but...)

Fast Attack

Baal w/Ass Can and Heavy Bolters-145
Baal w/Ass Can and Heavy Bolters-145

Heavy Support

Pred w/Auto Cannon LasCans-135pts
Pred w/Auto Cannon LasCans-135pts


Thanks again

"Primus Enire Ultima Exire"
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-14-10, 05:13 AM
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as far as it goes for BA mech, it looks fine to me, though i think i would drop the PW from the Sang. Priest to upgrade PW in a couple of RAS to PF.

this way you'd have more anti-MC hunting spread out throughout the list.

good hunting.

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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-14-10, 08:55 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inquisitor Malaclypse View Post
as far as it goes for BA mech, it looks fine to me, though i think i would drop the PW from the Sang. Priest to upgrade PW in a couple of RAS to PF.

this way you'd have more anti-MC hunting spread out throughout the list.

good hunting.
Thanks for the input, although I kind of like the PW I feel they benefit more from the FC with the small squads. The Int5 Str5 PW strikes really goes a long way. Good point on the MC's, I was thinking of dealing with them the highland way...run, hide and shoot w/AssCans.

Any rate I messed up on my points spread so here are some adjustments let me know what you guys think...

Headquarters

Libby w/TDA (Shield/Rage) - 125pts

Elites

5 Assault Termies w/2 Thammers and 3 LCs (Priest/Libby attached) - 210 pts
Dedicated Transport: LRC w/EA 265pts

2 Sang Priests, one PW- 115pts

Troops

RAS x5 w/PF and Melta in AssCan Razorback (Priest w/PW attached)-190pts
RAS x5 w/PW and Melta in AssCan Razorback-180pts
RAS x5 w/PW and Melta in AssCan Razorback-180pts
RAS x5 w/PW and Flamer in AssCan Razorback-175pts


Fast Attack

Baal w/Ass Can and Heavy Bolters-145
Baal w/Ass Can and Heavy Bolters-145

Heavy Support

Pred w/Auto Cannon LasCans-135pts
Pred w/Auto Cannon LasCans-135pts


Thanks again

"Primus Enire Ultima Exire"
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-15-10, 01:32 AM
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To be perfectly honest? I don't like it.

One land raider is way too easy to block/delay. Raiders work best in pairs, one is a pain but two is a problem.

Your psychic powers look good to me, just don't cast unleash rage the turn you charge unless your positive your opponent won't run away/all die.
Lance is always a good alternative to rage but I think rage will work better for your termies.

Next we come to your termies, I'm really curious what makes me people LC are worth it? You lose the ability to threaten MC and vehicles and your 3++ for what, rerolls to wound but at S4/5 and an extra attack? So doesn't seem worth it.
Your claws save you a grand total of 15 points at the moment, yay?

Your choice of land raider looks good but I would always run a multi-melta on it.

I'm not sold on 5 man assault squads in razor backs with CC upgrades, you can't charge after the razor moves and 5 MEQs don't scare much you small squads will need to gang up on others to handle anything more threatening than tau fire warriors.

The baals and preds seem ok but I persoanlly prefer MM/HF speeders over baals and rifle dreads over preds, but baals/preds aren't bad.

But the main issue is you have one rock that is just too easy to block/delay.

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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-15-10, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuolema View Post
To be perfectly honest? I don't like it.

One land raider is way too easy to block/delay. Raiders work best in pairs, one is a pain but two is a problem.

Your psychic powers look good to me, just don't cast unleash rage the turn you charge unless your positive your opponent won't run away/all die.
Lance is always a good alternative to rage but I think rage will work better for your termies.

Next we come to your termies, I'm really curious what makes me people LC are worth it? You lose the ability to threaten MC and vehicles and your 3++ for what, rerolls to wound but at S4/5 and an extra attack? So doesn't seem worth it.
Your claws save you a grand total of 15 points at the moment, yay?

Your choice of land raider looks good but I would always run a multi-melta on it.

I'm not sold on 5 man assault squads in razor backs with CC upgrades, you can't charge after the razor moves and 5 MEQs don't scare much you small squads will need to gang up on others to handle anything more threatening than tau fire warriors.

The baals and preds seem ok but I persoanlly prefer MM/HF speeders over baals and rifle dreads over preds, but baals/preds aren't bad.

But the main issue is you have one rock that is just too easy to block/delay.
Seriousally??? Im not sure you actually know what your talking about. Preds are awsome LCAC that. Speeder's are ok but 2xMM attack bike are where the real value is at!

The 5man squads are scoring. Thats it! There not there for charging. Stay in the razors for as long as possible. The termies NEED to be in a redeemer. Its soooo much better than a LRC.

Not sold on Baals but there not terrible. Maybe suggest dropping them in favour or 1 more aclc pred and 2 MM attack bikes.

Have you tried a 10man JP squad with fist and 2x melta. They have been my star performers. drop 1 razor squad and use points from the TA on the libby as he doesnt need it.

As regards LC on termies... where to start well you dont want 3 you only want 2 as you will be taking plenty of invuls so 3++ is good. The LC are there for I5 s5 re-roll to hit(libby) and the reroll to wound. That WILL threten any MC and the TH will finnish it off. But the LC work best against infantry with the I5 S5 re-rolls. Honestly there crazy! then they can take the wounds from the attacks back to save your termeis taking wounds ensuring they hit but because the LC are I5 on charge of course they have already killed half of most squads....dont believe me roll it.

I prefer Lasplas Razorbacks but Asscannon spam is ok too i guess.

BTW 1 raider is enough. i play 1 raider and more offten than not it gets blown up but unfortunatally its already done the dam by delivering the termies. just be careful on deployment with it. Yes it does occasionally get blown up first turn but thats very rare.

Ive also been playing with a single furioso in a pod. Sounds crap i know and trust me i thought 1 dread in a pod....but its worked wonders for me and boy does it draw some fire away from the raider! just make sure you either have good cover when you land or smoke it.

just my 2 pounds worth

All in all the list is pretty strong. few tweeks here and there and it will be very competetive. happy hunting
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-16-10, 05:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timsmith View Post
Seriousally??? Im not sure you actually know what your talking about. Preds are awsome LCAC that. Speeder's are ok but 2xMM attack bike are where the real value is at!
My double twin-linked auto-cannon dread is 120 points.
Your auto/las pred is 135 points.

Dread gets 4 shots at BS4 with re-roll misses
Pred gets 3 shots at BS4, no re-rolls.

Yes the pred has +2 armor penetration on two of it's shots but dread will land more shots.

Auto/las preds are still good, I just prefer rifle dreads.



Quote:
The 5man squads are scoring. Thats it! There not there for charging. Stay in the razors for as long as possible. The termies NEED to be in a redeemer. Its soooo much better than a LRC.
A redeemer is not better than a crusader but a crusader isn't better either. Both choices are good.


Quote:
Not sold on Baals but there not terrible. Maybe suggest dropping them in favour or 1 more aclc pred and 2 MM attack bikes.
Bikes are slower than speeders, only get one gun and can't jump over things.
Quote:
Have you tried a 10man JP squad with fist and 2x melta. They have been my star performers. drop 1 razor squad and use points from the TA on the libby as he doesnt need it.
Jumpers work better in pure jumper lists, with mech lists you want as many vehicles as possible to give your opponent more targets than they have AT guns.

Quote:
As regards LC on termies... where to start well you dont want 3 you only want 2 as you will be taking plenty of invuls so 3++ is good. The LC are there for I5 s5 re-roll to hit(libby) and the reroll to wound. That WILL threten any MC and the TH will finnish it off. But the LC work best against infantry with the I5 S5 re-rolls. Honestly there crazy! then they can take the wounds from the attacks back to save your termeis taking wounds ensuring they hit but because the LC are I5 on charge of course they have already killed half of most squads....dont believe me roll it.
LC with FC are not bad, they aren't amazing either. When they aren't charging TH/SS are much better.

Quote:
BTW 1 raider is enough. i play 1 raider and more offten than not it gets blown up but unfortunatally its already done the dam by delivering the termies. just be careful on deployment with it. Yes it does occasionally get blown up first turn but thats very rare.
Please play a few games against someone who understands how to use blocking tactics.

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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-17-10, 10:42 PM
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First of all, I think the list is great, and is eerily similar to a list I just came up with a few weeks ago:




In other words, I like it!

Now for the drama:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuolema View Post
My double twin-linked auto-cannon dread is 120 points.
Your auto/las pred is 135 points.

Dread gets 4 shots at BS4 with re-roll misses
Pred gets 3 shots at BS4, no re-rolls.

Yes the pred has +2 armor penetration on two of it's shots but dread will land more shots.

Auto/las preds are still good, I just prefer rifle dreads.
You forget that Autocannons are TWO shots at S7 AP4, not one. The difference between the Predator turret's Autocannon and your Dreadnought's Autocannon is the Dread's is Twin Linked. The Auto/Las predator is INSANE for its points, and can easily pick apart higher-armored targets where the Dread will have trouble.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuolema View Post
A redeemer is not better than a crusader but a crusader isn't better either. Both choices are good.


Simply wrong here. There's a reason the Crusader is the only Land Raider brought to tournaments, and that's because the Redeemer (and regular one) are big steamy piles of crap. You won't EVER fire both flame templates off of the Redeemer in the same turn unless your opponent is just being dumb, and it has to get to the front lines to use those Marine-killing flamers, meaning it is even more of a target than the other LR's. Not to mention the fact that if you disembark from your Redeemer, you typically won't be able to use your flame templates because you'll have to place it over your own models which is illegal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuolema View Post
Bikes are slower than speeders, only get one gun and can't jump over things.
Bikes are slower than speeders??? WHAT? Both move up to 24" and can fire after moving 12".... (and bikes can fire everything after moving 12")

As for "get only one gun and can't jump over things", they cost HALF as much and ignore difficult terrain (just roll dangerous). Attack Bikes cost 50 points base and come with a Twin-Linked Bolter AND a Heavy Bolter, AND it's T5 with 2 wounds. Statistically it does better than a Speeder because it can shrug off more small-arms fire.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuolema View Post
Jumpers work better in pure jumper lists, with mech lists you want as many vehicles as possible to give your opponent more targets than they have AT guns.
First part is not true, second part is. Yes, mech needs many vehicles, but Jumpers do great in multiple different lists. You should try a mixed Mech/Jumper list, they do quite well (see my batrep between Salamanders and Blood Angels).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuolema View Post
LC with FC are not bad, they aren't amazing either. When they aren't charging TH/SS are much better.
As stated by the poster before you, yes I5 S5 Power Weapons that re-roll the to-wound roll are often better than TH/SS Termies. They can deal with everything a TH/SS Termie can (offensively), and if you're using them for armor busting, you're doing it wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuolema View Post
Please play a few games against someone who understands how to use blocking tactics.
Please calm down and don't assume that every game, on turn one, that the Land Raider will be screwed.

I don't know how many games I've played of 40k 5th with my 1 Land Raider Crusader where the ONLY damage it takes (even against armies with tons of melta/heavy weaponry) is the friggin immobilization that happens when I try to be ballsy and move it over difficult terrain.

You seem very angry and biased towards certain units though your info seems to be slightly off. Not picking a fight, just saying that even after the thousands of games of 5th and hundreds I've played with the new codex, I'm still learning things here and there. Try playtesting some of the stuff above for a few games to maybe have a more well-rounded opinion.

"Sometimes you just have to roll the hard six." -Admiral Adama

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Blood Angels - 15k pts
Tyranids - >9k pts

Tau - ~4k
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-17-10, 10:56 PM
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dbgoldberg...
Don't worry, Kuolema got banned. I have discussed his "advice" with other vets of this site and it is painfully obvious he has hardly actually played any real games and just regurgitates what he reads on other blogs/sites. Hence why he just started throwing in links to those sites to try to justify his views. (which after doing that for like 4 threads I think that is what got him banned.)
As to bl0230's list: Yeah, I would definintely have to stop and really think hard how to beat this on the TT if we were facing each other. Let us know how it plays out for you!
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-18-10, 11:21 PM Thread Starter
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Hey everyone!!

Sorry I've neglected my thread, unfortunately my internet has been down all week.
But thankfully its up and running. Thanks for all the feedback, I guess the best thing to do is get the list built and start play testing it to work out the kinks.

Thanks Again Brian

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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 11-19-10, 12:52 PM
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He got banned? That's sad, but maybe it was needed. I actually agreed with much of what he said lol. Anyway, just thought I would put in some food for thought

1: A single raider, as mentioned, is not optimal. Reason being that it is "1" unit, and it suffers from the "death star syndrom". Sorry to say, but the easiest matches I have is vs. single land raiders. Easy to destroy with fast melta, and easy to ignore if you make a mistake with it.

2: The CC weapons on the assault squads are kinda waste, as someone mentioned. They won't really do much in this list.

3: I would get speeders. Attack bikes are good, and easy to hide, but they can't deep strike, and they don't get a heavy flamer

4: I wouldn't have priests in a mech list like this. You pay 100+ points for eventual FNP on small squads that are still easy to get rid of, bar the fact they are in transports.

So, my suggestion is to drop the LRC, the termis, TDA on libby (give him shield of Sanguinius + what you want) and the priests. You get what? around 600 points spared?
Now invest in 2 more preds, a couple speeders, and 1-2 assault squads in razorbacks. This way you get many more units on the table, and are able to threaten more effectively with more fast melta, and more preds.

Hope it is of some help
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