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-   -   Which race would you like to see as a major one, and which would you kick out? (https://www.heresy-online.net/forums/40k-fluff/202570-race-would-you-like-see-major-one-would-you-kick-out.html)

Brobaddon 02-18-16 07:28 PM

Which race would you like to see as a major one, and which would you kick out?
 
Supposed you could remove/add your own choice to tabletop and fluff, who would you kick out and who would you add ( from minor races or something of your own )

What i'd like to see is some form of advanced human/abhuman civizilation outside of Imperium, maybe like the Interex or Brotherhood of Ruin or even Hrud perhaps.

I'd definitely kick out Tau seeing how the latest codex and supplements are a total steaming pile of garbage, plus I never liked them.

Who would you add kick out of 40k and for what reasons?

Tyriks 02-18-16 07:50 PM

I would kick out Orks because I don't feel like they fit. Everything in the setting is Grimdark, but they're the three stooges in space. I don't like it.

I would replace them with basically new Orks. I would make them less comically stupid and more like an idealized feudal Japan, where they still respect strength above everything but aren't just a slapstick routine with bad jokes for names. I would also play with the statline to make them better individually (instead of just hoping to overwhelm through numbers).

Battman 02-18-16 08:24 PM

Depends on your opion, personally I love some of the ork fluff. Note some the lore which shows them as a giantic muscle bound creatures similar to a gorilla but intelligent enough for the basic use of weapons.

The comical side certainly doesn't fit as well, some authors take it with liberties, going from their lack of pain for a goofy slapstick.

I'd recomend "rynns world" it shows the other side quite well, it demonstrates the hazard that orks can be if they invade a world as well as the violence that they can inflict even to marines such as the crimson fists.

As to races that id like to see a more major role? It would actually be some of the more minor races such as the creatures from the Ghoul Stars who even in the turbulent galaxy haven't been wiped out for some reason and have a chapter of marines watching their everymove, they must be something interesting.

As to removal of a race for its interations/breaking of the fluff? I actually don't have one, the stories are not perfect but they work as an expanded and overarching story.

Tyriks 02-18-16 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battman (Post 2301882)
Depends on your opion, personally I love some of the ork fluff. Note some the lore which shows them as a giantic muscle bound creatures similar to a gorilla but intelligent enough for the basic use of weapons.

The comical side certainly doesn't fit as well, some authors take it with liberties, going from their lack of pain for a goofy slapstick.

I'd recomend "rynns world" it shows the other side quite well, it demonstrates the hazard that orks can be if they invade a world as well as the violence that they can inflict even to marines such as the crimson fists.

As to races that id like to see a more major role? It would actually be some of the more minor races such as the creatures from the Ghoul Stars who even in the turbulent galaxy haven't been wiped out for some reason and have a chapter of marines watching their everymove, they must be something interesting.

As to removal of a race for its interations/breaking of the fluff? I actually don't have one, the stories are not perfect but they work as an expanded and overarching story.

It's not the way they're depicted in novels so much as the actual codex. Deff coptas? Weirdboys? I just can't take them seriously with names like those. I like the aesthetic of them, and they seem like they'd be fun to play, I just can't stand the goofiness.

Lord of the Night 02-18-16 10:05 PM

151 Attachment(s)
I wouldn't actually remove any of the current Xenos races on the Tabletop, but I would definitely add these boys;

http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Rak'Gol

The Rak'gol make the Orks look like wimps and the Dark Eldar look like sadist-amateurs.


LotN

Nordicus 02-18-16 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord of the Night (Post 2301970)
I wouldn't actually remove any of the current Xenos races on the Tabletop, but I would definitely add these boys;

http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Rak'Gol

The Rak'gol make the Orks look like wimps and the Dark Eldar look like sadist-amateurs.


LotN

Damn you beat me to it - I would absolutely love to see those on the table!

As far as removing? Sisters of battle. Killer nuns in space just seems... well... Kinda like the new Ghostbuster movie; A fun idea, but best left as just that.

Brobaddon 02-18-16 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord of the Night (Post 2301970)
I wouldn't actually remove any of the current Xenos races on the Tabletop, but I would definitely add these boys;

http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Rak'Gol

The Rak'gol make the Orks look like wimps and the Dark Eldar look like sadist-amateurs.


LotN

Love it! Really liking these guys o.o Nice addition to the thread. Better start a petition!

As for Adepta Sororitas, I don't have issues with them aside the fact their armour is really overly too sexualized. I mean armor tits? Cmon.

Also dont have issues with Orks. They may look goofy and ramshackled, but I doubt anybody would laugh when faced with a screaming bloodthirsty horde.

R_Squared 02-18-16 11:20 PM

I wouldnt remove any race, I would expand tau.
When they first appeared I thought that they had enormous potential for introducing a host of interesting minor races.
However GW has homogenised them into an anime bore fest. Release the fetters and give us some cool mercs and auxiliaries, hrud, anthrazods, formosians, gue'vesa (sic), thraxians etc etc.

As to orks not fitting, along with SM's they are the first and core race of 40k. Everything else came later, and they ain't stoopid, they're kunnin. Hell they can speak gothic well enough that a guardsman can understand it, and it's a completely alien language which doesn't fit their vocal range or physiology. That, and they come up with new tek all the time, without having to rely on STCs, and have the most fearsome force field, gravity manipulation and teleporta tek in 40k.
It's a matter of perspective, if all you see is dumb orks, you're not looking hard enough, and are about to have your home world krumped. ;-)

Tyriks 02-18-16 11:28 PM

It's not that I think Orks have too low of an IQ. It's that I think Orks are dumb. Their tech works because they believe it will work, not because they actually can build any of those things. Everything's name is the same bad joke. I like the race, I like their look (generally), just not the whole postmodern space caveman concept.

R_Squared 02-18-16 11:54 PM

Ork tek doesn't work because they believe it works, the telyporta tekk, skokk attack gun, telyporta blastas, lifta dropped, stompas, koptas, dakkajets, everything works poppa.
The meks have knowledge of tek hardwired into their genes, but they're also imaginative, kreative and kunnin. They build stuff that works, it's straightforward and robust, but it works.

If orks arent "grimdork" enough for you, what about tau, they're the furthest from grimdark you can get, same for eldar actually, and space marines? Have you seen the latest SW wolf gubbins? It's ridiculous and looks like some bastardised cross over between pokemon and xenonblade.
But you'd ban orks because they don't spell proppa?

Plus, of all races Orks are the only ones who actually revel, nay thrive, in the 40k universe. They live for war. Conflict and aggression fuels them, accelerates their reproduction, and technological advancement and gives them a reason to exist. Every other race is miserable, and on the back foot, except for Orks. Tyranids and Necrons don't count because the concept of happiness is irrelevant to them. In fact, because of the eternal state of war in the 40k universe, Orks are already living in their paradise. There's no ideal state of peace for them to live, no unobtainable end game, they're already where they want to be. Orks have already won.

DelvarusThePitFighter 02-19-16 12:28 AM

Could take inspiration from some of the oop xenos ships from bfg - like the demiurgs etc?

Fuck Tau.

DelvarusThePitFighter 02-19-16 12:33 AM

I loved the orks in Space Marine - seemed to have brummy accents - XD
Made me wonder - pissed off WE with bad tempered eastend londoner accents - their chant 'You're goin' 'ome in landan ambulance, you're gonna get your fakin' 'ead kicked in'

Tyriks 02-19-16 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R_Squared (Post 2302026)
Ork tek doesn't work because they believe it works

This is exactly the reasoning behind having a "red paint job" upgrade for their vehicles. They think it will go faster, so that makes it go faster.

Quote:

If orks arent "grimdork" enough for you, what about tau, they're the furthest from grimdark you can get, same for eldar actually, and space marines? Have you seen the latest SW wolf gubbins? It's ridiculous and looks like some bastardised cross over between pokemon and xenonblade.
But you'd ban orks because they don't spell proppa?
The Tau ARE actually grimdark. Their leaders mind control the lower classes. They lobotomize races to make them fit better into their society. They convert everyone by the sword to their greater good. Eldar have known they are just waiting for extinction for 10,000 years. They force asceticism on their entire culture to try to survive a little bit longer. What's not grimdark about that? I'm not arguing about looks, so what the Wulfen look like doesn't matter.

The issue isn't the spelling, it's that literally every single thing about the army gets its name from the same bad joke. If even half their army had actual names (instead of just misspelling what a child would call the unit), I would feel a lot differently.

Quote:

Plus, of all races Orks are the only ones who actually revel, nay thrive, in the 40k universe. They live for war. Conflict and aggression fuels them, accelerates their reproduction, and technological advancement and gives them a reason to exist. Every other race is miserable, and on the back foot, except for Orks. Tyranids and Necrons don't count because the concept of happiness is irrelevant to them. In fact, because of the eternal state of war in the 40k universe, Orks are already living in their paradise. There's no ideal state of peace for them to live, no unobtainable end game, they're already where they want to be. Orks have already won.
This is an irrelevant point. No one is saying Orks don't like war, or aren't doing well in the fluff. What I am saying is that, for a setting that has gone so far out of its way to seem hopeless and doomed that a new word had to be invented to describe it, having a whole race for comic relief is annoying.

Doom wolf 02-19-16 06:02 AM

I love the orks for many reason.

They provide jobber for novel quite easily, yet, you know that if they loose it's not that bad, because you know they will always come back. There's no sense of "doom and gloom" like the space marines and even the CSM.

Maybe they just need more brutal depiction, and a little less funny one.

Now, I never liked the Tau. They are too much of the Mary sue about them. But strangely, I feel they should be expanded over the galaxy. Because this could provide some contact with real nasty stuff, and the opportunity to get wiped their ass once or twice, which would be an excuse to see their dark side.

Other than that, I return from the squat/demiurge, anyone ? XD

Doom wolf 02-19-16 06:03 AM

I love the orks for many reason.

They provide jobber for novel quite easily, yet, you know that if they loose it's not that bad, because you know they will always come back. There's no sense of "doom and gloom" like the space marines and even the CSM.

Maybe they just need more brutal depiction, and a little less funny one.

Now, I never liked the Tau. They are too much of the Mary sue about them. But strangely, I feel they should be expanded over the galaxy. Because this could provide some contact with real nasty stuff, and the opportunity to get wiped their ass once or twice, which would be an excuse to see their dark side.

Other than that, I return from the squat/demiurge, anyone ? XD

Battman 02-19-16 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord of the Night (Post 2301970)
I wouldn't actually remove any of the current Xenos races on the Tabletop, but I would definitely add these boys;

http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Rak'Gol

The Rak'gol make the Orks look like wimps and the Dark Eldar look like sadist-amateurs.


LotN

Hmm these sound cool as! I've not actually encountered before. Yet another interesting group of aliens from around the ghoul stars.

R_Squared 02-19-16 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyriks (Post 2302114)
This is exactly the reasoning behind having a "red paint job" upgrade for their vehicles. They think it will go faster, so that makes it go faster.


The Tau ARE actually grimdark. Their leaders mind control the lower classes. They lobotomize races to make them fit better into their society. They convert everyone by the sword to their greater good. Eldar have known they are just waiting for extinction for 10,000 years. They force asceticism on their entire culture to try to survive a little bit longer. What's not grimdark about that? I'm not arguing about looks, so what the Wulfen look like doesn't matter.

The issue isn't the spelling, it's that literally every single thing about the army gets its name from the same bad joke. If even half their army had actual names (instead of just misspelling what a child would call the unit), I would feel a lot differently.


This is an irrelevant point. No one is saying Orks don't like war, or aren't doing well in the fluff. What I am saying is that, for a setting that has gone so far out of its way to seem hopeless and doomed that a new word had to be invented to describe it, having a whole race for comic relief is annoying.

We're arguing over taste, so we're never going to agree.
The red paint job is one thing in the whole ork fluff that "works cause they want it too" there's no mention of any other thing that works like this it in the new codex at all. Have you read the new or codex? It's much less "goofy" than 2nd edition. In fact Orks havent been "goofy" for quite a while. However, as an ork player, I like the fact that they are not too serious, as to me this is a game, and it should be fun and entertaining. My job, mortgage and degree are serious enough, I don't need to take playing 40k seriously too.

If Orks weren't part of 40k, it would be a much changed beast, a lot of people would never have played it, and I think it probably would never have got off the ground. Orks are the ultimate protagonists for the imperium. The imperium is dour, and fretful, and violent and cruel, Orks are all also violent and cruel, but they're also cheerful. They're the only race that is. They are the antithesis of the imperium, which takes itself far to seriously. That's appealing to me.
Tau and eldar may have their faults, but they are not grimdork, that is solely the preserve of the imperium. All the other races have their own agendas and care not a whit for high gothic or nuns and monks in space, (and wacky space vikings).

Ork spelling is part of their kulture. It's not childish because they don't have children, it's simplified gothic, which as I mentioned before is impressive in its way. A brutal race with the physiology of a 400 pound gorilla that can speak a language with a jaw the size of a dustbin lid designed for squishy pink monkeys is quite a feat. The spelling reflects the simplicity and brutal mindset of Orks, if it was all Death Blitz fighter and the like, then it would be odd, because it doesn't fit their society. I've never heard of someone rubbishing an entire faction because they don't like the names.

hailene 02-19-16 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R_Squared (Post 2302202)
We're arguing over taste, so we're never going to agree.
The red paint job is one thing in the whole ork fluff that "works cause they want it too" there's no mention of any other thing that works like this it in the new codex at all.

In the Sanctus Reach novel there's some interesting fluff pertaining to this. The Mechboyz would occasionally talk in "mechboyz" lingo--that is, highly technical knowledge that the Old Ones bred into the Krork--Orks as we know them. One of the Mekboyz is trying to add a Knight's voidshield projector to his Stompa (with its own "bubble shield") when he says this:

"Caution must be taken when interfacing ionic technologies, especially those that originate with alien species whose consciousness wavelengths are incompatible with the psychically motivated etheric generators of the krork."

So we can see, at least, the "bubble shield" the Orks use are powered by some latent psychic power the Orks possess.

It's not absolute proof, but it does seem that at least some Ork technology works off their psychic powers--the belief that it works, perhaps?

Quote:

Originally Posted by R_Squared (Post 2302010)
I wouldnt remove any race, I would expand tau.

However GW has homogenised them into an anime bore fest.

I've asked this before, but never erally received an answer.

As an avid anime fan for the last 2 decades, I hardly see anything that specifically anime related about the Tau.

Piloted suits of armor is hardly something restricted to the anime medium.

We have dreadnoughts and Knights in WH40k alone. What's up with all this "anime" hype, anyway?

neferhet 02-19-16 08:59 AM

I'm digging the Rak'gol.
they are insane. nasty, evil, powerful xenos.
I dig them.
As for kicking out: Tau aka Gundam Tabletop game. They look like Infinity made an appearance in 40k. They are not grimdark, they are not visually compatible with the gothic enviroment, they have abusive rule and are (sorry guys) a point-click army. Not fun to play with nor against. They where born just to stim Wh40k in a time where it looked like it was all going to crumble for the bad sales. Fuck them.

Brobaddon 02-19-16 11:24 AM

Quote:

As an avid anime fan for the last 2 decades, I hardly see anything that specifically anime related about the Tau.
Agreed with Hailene here. I dislike Tau, but i don't see anything anime-ish in them. Pilot driven mechs are hardly anime, and they certainly don't look like anime mechs, which are usually ridiculous and are little more than literal fighting suits able to do just anything. At least the Tau' suits have limitations and battlefield roles that suits the more military approach of sci-fi. It's not just one man's army.

Though I can guess people see a lot of asian philosophy in them, especially borrowed from japanese mythology and culture so automatically they link them to anime, which is nonsensical to me.

But yeah, agreed with Delvarus, fuck Tau. I wish Stormlord and Necrons ripped Shadowsun a new one.

Quote:

They are not grimdark, they are not visually compatible with the gothic enviroment
And eldar and orks are? Why should they have to be compatible? They're their own race , culture and what not, no matter how sucky they are. I mean, Gothic is human made term, steaming from our own culture and fiction. Why would Tau be Gothic? That makes no sense.

neferhet 02-19-16 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brobaddon (Post 2302330)
And eldar and orks are? Why should they have to be compatible? They're their own race , culture and what not, no matter how sucky they are. I mean, Gothic is human made term, steaming from our own culture and fiction. Why would Tau be Gothic? That makes no sense.

eldar are gothic as fuck :) llok at the armours, the buildings, everything screams grotesque style and visual/geometrical excess. orks..yep, they too are grotesque enough to be fitting. Tau are too linear, too tidy. they are out of the visual concept of grimdark, completely. Everything in wh40k has a visual link, a design "integrity". tau are not to be found within this same design, imo.
i own some tau models, had fun painting it, and fun using them as a force in a story driven scenario. But i really can't "see" them side by side with any other model of the range.
Of course i understand that a wide galaxy has a wide spectrum of shapes and "alien evolution" that might differ from human made terms. but this aint reality. it's a game. a fictional universe driven by a recurring theme: grimdark; and tau are just not there.

ArkInRev 02-19-16 02:47 PM

I dislike Tau. I like the "greater good" idea, but they are all sorts of Gundam. The style is not my thing. To me, the aesthetic is a little more Star Trek and a bit less Grimdark.

Some Slann/Old one action bubbling to the top could be interesting. Space lizards with a tie to Cthulu Old Gods incarnation would add a little more variety to the landscape.

Tyriks 02-19-16 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R_Squared (Post 2302202)
We're arguing over taste, so we're never going to agree.
The red paint job is one thing in the whole ork fluff that "works cause they want it too" there's no mention of any other thing that works like this it in the new codex at all. Have you read the new or codex? It's much less "goofy" than 2nd edition. In fact Orks havent been "goofy" for quite a while. However, as an ork player, I like the fact that they are not too serious, as to me this is a game, and it should be fun and entertaining. My job, mortgage and degree are serious enough, I don't need to take playing 40k seriously too.

If Orks weren't part of 40k, it would be a much changed beast, a lot of people would never have played it, and I think it probably would never have got off the ground. Orks are the ultimate protagonists for the imperium. The imperium is dour, and fretful, and violent and cruel, Orks are all also violent and cruel, but they're also cheerful. They're the only race that is. They are the antithesis of the imperium, which takes itself far to seriously. That's appealing to me.
Tau and eldar may have their faults, but they are not grimdork, that is solely the preserve of the imperium. All the other races have their own agendas and care not a whit for high gothic or nuns and monks in space, (and wacky space vikings).

Ork spelling is part of their kulture. It's not childish because they don't have children, it's simplified gothic, which as I mentioned before is impressive in its way. A brutal race with the physiology of a 400 pound gorilla that can speak a language with a jaw the size of a dustbin lid designed for squishy pink monkeys is quite a feat. The spelling reflects the simplicity and brutal mindset of Orks, if it was all Death Blitz fighter and the like, then it would be odd, because it doesn't fit their society. I've never heard of someone rubbishing an entire faction because they don't like the names.

You are still the only person talking about spelling. Please read my last post. Also, I'm not saying Ork children came up with their names, so why bring Ork children into it? You are focusing too much on details of what I'm saying to get what I'm actually saying.

I have not read the newest Ork codex because I'm not interested in Orks. I'm not going to spend $50 on a book I don't really want. Older codices do explicitly say that Ork tech works because they believe it will. I find that too absurd for me to get into.

As far as 40k being fun, I don't know why you need an army to be goofy to think it's more fun than paying your mortgage. I have plenty of fun with Imperium armies, and it is not impeded even the tiniest bit by how seriously the Imperium takes itself. In fact, that never even occurs to me while I'm playing.

ntaw 02-19-16 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hailene (Post 2302234)
I hardly see anything that specifically anime related about the Tau.

It's my suspicion that with the internet being what it is, this opinion has proliferated without any fact checking (think Facebook post shares). At this point we are likely helpless to stop it; just accept that Tau look like Gundam and Gundam are what a lot of people think anime is. 'Cuz you know, Pokemon, Sailor Moon, Dragon Ball (Z), Speed Racer, Yu-Gi-Oh, Beyblade, etc. etc., were never really all that popular.

On topic:

I would love to see Tyranids become more of a thing, and more fights between them and Necrons (without Blood Angels being involved). Unless some Primarchs show back up it seems like it will be those two races and Orks in a punch fest over the known 40k universe with the Chaos Gods kickin' it in the background sipping some tea and talking about how much fun those humans were in the good old days.

Brobaddon 02-19-16 03:58 PM

eldar are gothic as fuck :) llok at the armours, the buildings, everything screams grotesque style and visual/geometrical excess

Dark Eldar, yes, with all the neo-vampire/dark and what not, but Craftworld Eldar hardly. Yeah some buildings have similar traits, but them themselves are hardly " dark ". Especially the fact they like to preserve their shrine/maiden worlds and what not.

Orks even less really, they're brutal, but so is Tau's philosophy. It only looks nice and peaceful on the outside but on the inside it's nothing but hive mind kind of notion almost. As soon as you reject the water caste, you'll have your world burn. Hardly not " grimdark " You're too focused on the design and exterior.

Quote:

but they are all sorts of Gundam.
So, then even dreadnaughts and Titan Legios are " gundam " too? They're not really. I see tau battlesuits as nothing but alien in design.

Quote:

I would love to see Tyranids become more of a thing, and more fights between them and Necrons (without Blood Angels being involved). Unless some Primarchs show back up it seems like it will be those two races and Orks in a punch fest over the known 40k universe with the Chaos Gods kickin' it in the background sipping some tea and talking about how much fun those humans were in the good old days.
Hm, well Hive Fleet Leviathan is on it's course to Terra isn't it? I could see this becoming a major event in the codexes and books. I mean, they did almost reduce Ultramar do the rubble didn't they?

As for Necrons, I'd like that too, but hopefully the awful models will change with the coming of next codex :/

ArkInRev 02-19-16 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brobaddon (Post 2302538)
So, then even dreadnaughts and Titan Legios are " gundam " too? They're not really.

No, the others are not. But it's difficult not to see it in Tau. It's not surprising that people are looking to Gundam models for Tau Conversions. Thread Reference Netierh the big ones nor the little ones are really my thing.
http://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery...comparison.JPG

neferhet 02-19-16 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brobaddon (Post 2302538)
eldar are gothic as fuck llok at the armours, the buildings, everything screams grotesque style and visual/geometrical excess Dark Eldar, yes, with all the neo-vampire/dark and what not, but Craftworld Eldar hardly. Yeah some buildings have similar traits, but them themselves are hardly " dark ". Especially the fact they like to preserve their shrine/maiden worlds and what not. Orks even less really, they're brutal, but so is Tau's philosophy. It only looks nice and peaceful on the outside but on the inside it's nothing but hive mind kind of notion almost. As soon as you reject the water caste, you'll have your world burn. Hardly not " grimdark " You're too focused on the design and exterior.

beg to differ. if this is not some over the top - gothic - grotesque stuff...i don't know what is it. and don't let me start comparing models.
http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/...20120811161407
http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/...20141120193458
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/...20150316065130

Brobaddon 02-19-16 05:05 PM

I said, you're focusing too much on design. In any case, we'll have to agree to disagree. Now let's go back on topic.

I admit LordofNight has hyped me with Rak'gol. Though I wonder whether games workshop even has a new race in mind, which I doubt. I guess sales would need to drastically drop again for them to introduce something entirely new.

Brother Lucian 02-19-16 05:42 PM

My oppinion: Kick the Tau out, they are a minor race and should stay one. And they recently got quite the well deserved bloody nose from overreaching.

The necrons should have a major tune up again. Make them succesful in ressurecting the ancient necrontyr and setting them up for a scism between the undeath and life factions of their race. With the imperium growing torn between supporting and allying with them, or declaring the livecrons xeno horrificus. Especially so if they turn to mass harvest space marine bodies as vessels for necron souls as previously hinted at.

R_Squared 02-19-16 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyriks (Post 2302466)
You are still the only person talking about spelling. Please read my last post. Also, I'm not saying Ork children came up with their names, so why bring Ork children into it? You are focusing too much on details of what I'm saying to get what I'm actually saying.

I have not read the newest Ork codex because I'm not interested in Orks. I'm not going to spend $50 on a book I don't really want. Older codices do explicitly say that Ork tech works because they believe it will. I find that too absurd for me to get into.

As far as 40k being fun, I don't know why you need an army to be goofy to think it's more fun than paying your mortgage. I have plenty of fun with Imperium armies, and it is not impeded even the tiniest bit by how seriously the Imperium takes itself. In fact, that never even occurs to me while I'm playing.

OK, I understand that they're not to your taste, but I was just trying to bring to your attention a few things that as an ork player I know about, and that you didn't appear to know about, or appreciate before calling to squat the faction.
Orks haven't been "goofy", probably since at least 6th edition, I did mention that before i'm sure? I couldn't say what it was like for sure before then, the last experience I had with 40k up until 2 years ago was back, was in the 80s in the days of rogue trader.
I don't play them because they're "goofy" though, or enjoy them for that reason, I play them because I enjoy the fact that they are fun to play, and don't take themseIves too seriously. Their outlook is that war is fun, and that encourages me to play to that philosophy. For example, I often make decisions that favour an Orks outlook, if given a number of choices. It's like I'm role playing to a degree.
I think I would do that if I was playing any faction. However, I personally prefer to play the bad guys, and play something different, something alien. Whilst I appreciate Imperial forces, personally I wouldn't want to play them, except for maybe Mechanics, they're practically a different species.
I'm glad there are people willing to play imperial forces though, it's better to have a bredth of opponents to play against. I even like to play against Tau, which is why I didn't call for them to be squatted. In fact I think they should be expanded, a whole raft of xenos species waiting to deploy for the greater good would be an enrichment of the game.

hailene 02-19-16 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArkInRev (Post 2302602)
No, the others are not. But it's difficult not to see it in Tau. It's not surprising that people are looking to Gundam models for Tau Conversions.

Linked in the link you shared is one asking about Gundam conversions to stand in as Imperial nights.

The general bodyshape of the Tau battlesuits don't match most Gundams. Gundams tend to have large legs and a fairly slim top (barring some extra heavy ones or ones with wings or something). Tau battle suits follow the general WH40k shape--small legs, wider shoulders.

Color doesn't even close and of course the heads are way different.

Still makes no real sense to me.

ArkInRev 02-19-16 08:45 PM

You're right, I think I quickly went to the wrong thread. There are quite a few posts and images correlating Tau and Gundam.

But I don't think that there are no similarities: (Excuse the low quality recolor) I can see the difference, but the latter reminds me quite a bit of the former.
http://i65.tinypic.com/t88b60.jpg

hailene 02-19-16 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArkInRev (Post 2302818)
You're right, I think I quickly went to the wrong thread. There are quite a few posts and images correlating Tau and Gundam.

But I don't think that there are no similarities: (Excuse the low quality recolor) I can see the difference, but the latter reminds me quite a bit of the former.
http://i65.tinypic.com/t88b60.jpg

No, the thread you linked was originally about Gundam models standing in for Tau. There's just another link within the thread that links another thread where someone was looking to make Gundam conversions for Imperial Knights.

I still don't seem much resemblance between the two. Starting from top to bottom...

Feet and ankles are completely different. The proportions of the feet and "thighs" are completely different, too. How the hips are articulated are different. The XV02's joints are splayed out.

There's that little codpiece-like thing on both of them. That is a point of similarity.

The XV02's waist also slims way down. The Gundam's has some narrowing, but no where near to the same degree. The shoulders and chest look nothing alike. The red area of the chest where the Gundam pilot would exit does look similar to the red area on the XV02, but in the original coloring from the Tau codex, it does not appear as if the front has that concave slope that the Gundam does. The front of the battlesuit is likely flat and not angled.

The strongest resemblance between the two are the forearms and hands. Even so, it's not too close since the proportion of the arms to the rest of the body is very different.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Besides the idea that they're supposed to be humanoid, there's not too much to directly compare. You couldn't imagine dropping a Gundam mostly unmodified into a Tau army and not have it look conspicuous.

ArkInRev 02-19-16 09:43 PM

I still see it, and my vote is still out. Still unfortunately lowest on the totem pole for me.

hailene 02-19-16 09:52 PM

I don't think you're going to find very many anime fans that go "oh, man, that looks like a mecha."

If you want to argue that some of the Tau battlesuits appear to be inspired by Japanese Mecha to someone that does not really know mecha, then I can agree with that, I suppose.

Tyriks 02-19-16 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R_Squared (Post 2302746)
OK, I understand that they're not to your taste, but I was just trying to bring to your attention a few things that as an ork player I know about, and that you didn't appear to know about, or appreciate before calling to squat the faction.
Orks haven't been "goofy", probably since at least 6th edition, I did mention that before i'm sure? I couldn't say what it was like for sure before then, the last experience I had with 40k up until 2 years ago was back, was in the 80s in the days of rogue trader.
I don't play them because they're "goofy" though, or enjoy them for that reason, I play them because I enjoy the fact that they are fun to play, and don't take themseIves too seriously. Their outlook is that war is fun, and that encourages me to play to that philosophy. For example, I often make decisions that favour an Orks outlook, if given a number of choices. It's like I'm role playing to a degree.
I think I would do that if I was playing any faction. However, I personally prefer to play the bad guys, and play something different, something alien. Whilst I appreciate Imperial forces, personally I wouldn't want to play them, except for maybe Mechanics, they're practically a different species.
I'm glad there are people willing to play imperial forces though, it's better to have a bredth of opponents to play against. I even like to play against Tau, which is why I didn't call for them to be squatted. In fact I think they should be expanded, a whole raft of xenos species waiting to deploy for the greater good would be an enrichment of the game.

It seems like the issue is a divergent idea of what is goofy. I think having an entire army/culture based off of mispronounced slang is goofy. You don't, evidently. But I think you're taking my dislike too seriously (ironically), since the thread is just asking if I had to pick one race to go who it would be. I'm not saying fuck everything about Orks or their players, or that GW realistically should cut them, but they are the least interesting race to me since they are so ridiculously one-sided. I'm just not into that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hailene (Post 2302858)
I don't think you're going to find very many anime fans that go "oh, man, that looks like a mecha."

If you want to argue that some of the Tau battlesuits appear to be inspired by Japanese Mecha to someone that does not really know mecha, then I can agree with that, I suppose.

I knew three people who thought about getting into 40k as Tau because they liked Gundam (not sure which specific series) and Robotech. Obviously, they aren't the same, but there are stylistic similarities beyond the fact that they are giant robot suits.

hailene 02-19-16 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyriks (Post 2302866)
I knew three people who thought about getting into 40k as Tau because they liked Gundam (not sure which specific series) and Robotech. Obviously, they aren't the same, but there are stylistic similarities beyond the fact that they are giant robot suits.

Weird they'd use Robotech. That was sort of a travesty since they basically butchered the Japanese Macross to make Robotech.

I'd be interested in hearing what sort of reasons and similarities the Tau battlesuits drew them.

The Tau suits look really blocky and oddly top heavy (pretty typical for WH40k models from everything from an Emperor-class titan to a Space marine).

It's a pretty different aesthetic to me.

Digg40k 02-19-16 10:51 PM

I wouldn't kick any of the current factions out and I'm bemused by the outpouring of criticism towards Orks and Tau.

Orks are brutal, cunning and violent killers.

Tau are brutal, cunning and violent killers.

The 40k universe is brimmed full of brutal, cunning and violent killers, are we done on that?

As for who I would add. Well come on... Squats innit.

hailene 02-19-16 11:05 PM

I guess on topic. If I had to kill a faction it'd be the new Necrons.

I don't need more extremely powerful, haughty lords with great technology that also can be both extremely cruel and magnanimous on pretty much a whim.

They're called the Eldar.

I'd rather have a soulless horde out to annihilate all life.

Yeah, we already have the Tyranids, but I rather have a second Tyranids than a second Eldar.

Brobaddon 02-19-16 11:53 PM

Yeah the current Necrons are terrible, both lore and design wise. The models/art is too over-detailed and appear to be made for 10 year olds literally, with cliche scythes for " undead robots " to largely the same skeleton heads on each unit, save for deathmarks. I doubt they'll drop the whole egyptian theme, but at least hope the units get a remodelling in next codex, cause they'll simply terrible. At least remodel the heads to be somewhat unique and screw those ugly crowns.

As for lore wise, I expect them to do something actually important, like smite the nids and establish themselves as number one enemy to Imperium.

As for Necrons getting flesh bodies again, I doubt it will happen. Lore wise it would make sense and they're actually trying to pull that off but tabletop wise I doubt they'll change the whole gimmick. People came to love the soulless undead machines, not some " we don't even know how they looked as necrontyr " fleshling race.


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