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-   -   Macharius- Greatest military mind in imperial history (https://www.heresy-online.net/forums/40k-fluff/130737-macharius-greatest-military-mind-imperial-history.html)

Emperorguard500 12-06-13 02:22 AM

Macharius- Greatest military mind in imperial history
 
only second to Emperor...his tactical/strategic acumen, military mind.. is unparalleled

i would say he even succeeded Horus and The Lion (both are considered the top two generals of the primarchs)

Ddraig Cymry 12-06-13 02:27 AM

True, Macharius is indeed a god amongst the Imperial Guard. Basically, Alexander the Great in space. However, I'm not sure about him being better than Horus or Lion, they both are primarchs after all, but who knows, maybe if he were alive Abaddon would be getting his ass kicked on Cadia.

Emperorguard500 12-06-13 04:43 AM

although imho...i think the lion had the greatest tactical mind of the primarchs, most would agree with me? even more so then Horus

Tawa 12-06-13 02:20 PM

I wouldn't mind seeing a few games of Regicide between the Lion, Horus, Macharius and the Big E :)

Geist 12-06-13 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ddraig Cymry (Post 1438361)
True, Macharius is indeed a god amongst the Imperial Guard. Basically, Alexander the Great in space. However, I'm not sure about him being better than Horus or Lion, they both are primarchs after all, but who knows, maybe if he were alive Abaddon would be getting his ass kicked on Cadia.

Consider the following, the Lion and Horus were considered the greatest tactical minds of the Great Crusade, but they also had the might of the Great Crusade Imperium behind them. That means Space Marine Legions of hundreds of thousands, a united Imperial Army(which includes a combined Navy/Guard), and a far greater tech level, and it still took hundreds of years to complete the Great Crusade. Macharius, using mainly imperial guard and a few space marine chapters, conquered a thousand worlds in 7 years.

Stormxlr 12-06-13 04:26 PM

@Geist you have to also consider though that it was just after age of strife (?) So everything was quite bad everywhere they dint have solid empire behind them just a handful of planets. also it was a whole dam galaxy and I'm sure there way more planets in it then a thousand. Also as you said the tech was more advanced so the enemies they were facing had somewhat equal tech or better. Also as you see aftet his death those world fell to instability but during the great crusade they were not only conquering but expanding the empire, building and expanding the new infrastructure.

MEQinc 12-06-13 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geist (Post 1439297)
Consider the following, the Lion and Horus were considered the greatest tactical minds of the Great Crusade, but they also had the might of the Great Crusade Imperium behind them. That means Space Marine Legions of hundreds of thousands, a united Imperial Army(which includes a combined Navy/Guard), and a far greater tech level,

The power at their disposal shouldn't matter in a debate about tactics and strategy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormxlr (Post 1439369)
Also as you see aftet his death those world fell to instability but during the great crusade they were not only conquering but expanding the empire, building and expanding the new infrastructure.

This is also a really good point. The Primarchs built an empire of millions of worlds, Macharius didn't actually achieve anything of lasting significance. Surely that must speak to his strategic ability to pacify conquered worlds.

Geist 12-06-13 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MEQinc (Post 1439857)
The power at their disposal shouldn't matter in a debate about tactics and strategy.

And there are hardly any details on those tactics and what strategies they used, so the resources they had at their disposal and the end result is all we really have.

Quote:

This is also a really good point. The Primarchs built an empire of millions of worlds, Macharius didn't actually achieve anything of lasting significance. Surely that must speak to his strategic ability to pacify conquered worlds.
That wasn't his job. His job was to conquer, it was the "missionaries and Inquisitorial teams that followed those conquests that were supposed to do the job of turning those planets into loyal parts of the imperium.

Same for the Primarchs, they conquered, but for the most part it was the Imperial Army and the Orators who's job it was to maintain those conquests.

emporershand89 12-06-13 11:16 PM

A God amongst Men yes, a Brave Warrior and Philosopher, and Warhammer 40k own verzion of Sun Tzu. Better than Horus or the Emporer??? I don't think so, his ambition and charisma is what made him great; the tactics were brutal and exacted a heavy toll on his men.

I would almost go to the extent to say that Macharius, while great, is on the lower end of the totem pole when compared to other Heroes and Villains of the Imperium.

MEQinc 12-07-13 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geist (Post 1439889)
That wasn't his job. His job was to conquer, it was the "missionaries and Inquisitorial teams that followed those conquests that were supposed to do the job of turning those planets into loyal parts of the imperium.

Same for the Primarchs, they conquered, but for the most part it was the Imperial Army and the Orators who's job it was to maintain those conquests.

Surely it is the duty of a conqueror to hold the worlds he takes? Otherwise he's just a raider with pretensions of greatness. It isn't solely the province of others to make the world loyal, how the conqueror goes about taking the world has an overwhelming impact on how the world feels about becoming Imperial. It determines how open they are to the work of the missionaries. The worlds taken by the Primarchs for the most part were willing to listen to the iterators, because of the strategies used to take those worlds. The worlds Macharius took uniformly rejected Imperial rule, clearly that reflects badly on how he took them.


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