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-   -   1500 double land raider (https://www.heresy-online.net/forums/chaos-marines-army-lists/118046-1500-double-land-raider.html)

Mossy Toes 11-08-12 07:01 PM

I don't think you can infiltrate with the Land Raiders since they aren't listed as a Designated Transport on the CSM entry of the codex, so you have to choose between deploying them in the can't-infiltrate Land Raider entry, or infiltrating them on their own/in a Designated Transport (read: a Rhino).

I could be blowing smoke out my arse here, though, so it'd be best to check up on this in the rules yourself.

Khorothis 11-09-12 06:23 AM

Nope, Master of Deception is pretty strict on this: D3 units of Infantry only.

The only loophole in there is that the unit itself must be Infantry, but if I add, say, a Jugger Lord, then the unit itself is still Infantry, except there's this guy with a big red machine bull. It's not much but it's there.

Magpie_Oz 11-09-12 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Khorothis (Post 1304127)
Nope, Master of Deception is pretty strict on this: D3 units of Infantry only.

The only loophole in there is that the unit itself must be Infantry, but if I add, say, a Jugger Lord, then the unit itself is still Infantry, except there's this guy with a big red machine bull. It's not much but it's there.

'cept that his unit type becomes Cavalry when he gets the Juggernaut.

Khorothis 11-09-12 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magpie_Oz (Post 1304130)
'cept that his unit type becomes Cavalry when he gets the Juggernaut.

You're missing the point: the unit he joins is still Infantry, not Cavalry. Hence the loophole.

Magpie_Oz 11-09-12 11:43 AM

Joining a unit doesn't change the IC's unit type so the unit that is Infantry might get the buff but not the IC.
The IC is considered part of the unit but not in all respects.

Either way I don't think it would even be possible :
Master of Deception takes place before deployment.
IC's join units during deployment either to the table or reserve.

So the IC isn't joined to the unit at the time the Infiltrate SR is conferred upon them.

mynameisgrax 11-09-12 01:37 PM

I like Khorothis's first version of the list, with the cultists. You really need at least 1-2 cheap objective grabbing units when playing 6th edition. At 1500 points I wouldn't use less than 3 troop choices, and 4 is definitely better.

Only other thing I can add is it might be nice to give the cultists a flamer. It really helps against hordes.

neferhet 11-09-12 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magpie_Oz (Post 1304218)
Joining a unit doesn't change the IC's unit type so the unit that is Infantry might get the buff but not the IC.
The IC is considered part of the unit but not in all respects.

Either way I don't think it would even be possible :
Master of Deception takes place before deployment.
IC's join units during deployment either to the table or reserve.

So the IC isn't joined to the unit at the time the Infiltrate SR is conferred upon them.

"Infiltrate" says that units that contain at least one model
with this special rule are deployed last,
after all other units (friend and foe)
have been deployed. And, most important an Independent Character without the Infiltrate special rule cannot join a unit
of Infiltrators during deployment

But nobody says "no" to an Infiltrating independent character joining a unit, hence granting the whole unit infiltrate...as long as he is infantry as you, magpie, said.

About "outflank" the thing is this: during deployment, you can
declare that any unit that contains at least one model with this special
rule is ouflanking.

So, after a good check on the rulebook, i must say that my csm in raiders cannot infiltrate. :)

@mynameisgrax: thanks for the input. in fact I might drop a terminator for a 10 man cultist squad...i'll do the math and modify the list :)

neferhet 11-09-12 04:13 PM

in the end i guess this is the "safest" solution for this kind of "all in" list.
I've dropped the reaper autocannon since it's going to shoot only once or twice in a game and costs half of the cultist squad...
I hope the cultist can be useful for surprising a "landraider-worried" opponent.
Fluffwise the khornate berzerkers are a punch in the eye, but i will manage this with my own fluff.
Now...I only need to assemble that damned landraider on my shelve :biggrin:

Huron

10 Chaos Marines
slaanesh
power weapon -champion -
icon of excess
ccw instead of bolters


10 Chaos Marines
khorne
power weapon -champion -
icon of wrath
ccw instead of bolters

Land Raider
dirge caster

Land Raider
dirge caster

9 Terminator
slaanesh
icon of excess
2 lightning claw
1 chainfist
4 combi plasma
4 combimelta

12 cultists
champion with shotgun

cheers!

edit: sorry for the double post, wasn't thinking about it...

Khorothis 11-09-12 06:27 PM

Wut da zog. Why have a squad of Khornates if the rest of the merry band is Slaaneshi? I'm sure you can milk the points for that (somehow, I'm too lazy right now to check). Khorne isn't too useful, especially when you have such a low unit count (2 Raiders, a Termie squad and a band of Cultists), making survivability much more important than the situational bonuses granted by Khorne. Other than that it's as good as it'll ever be in theory. I'm curious how this plays out in practice.


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