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post #61 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 12:15 PM
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I agree with Moriouce, actually. Whatever the driving force is behind everything happening the way it happens, whether it's scientific coincidence or a carefully laid out plan by forces greater than ourselves--that's the God I choose to believe in.

Most of the rules are just common sense for not being a dick.

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post #62 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 12:24 PM
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I agree with Moriouce, actually. Whatever the driving force is behind everything happening the way it happens, whether it's scientific coincidence or a carefully laid out plan by forces greater than ourselves--that's the God I choose to believe in.

Most of the rules are just common sense for not being a dick.
Actually the first four commandments are all about appeasing God's ego, and the seven deadly sins represent some of humanity's defining traits which all contain constructive potential. The Honour thy father and thy mother commandment is potentially a recipe for child abuse and should not be a rule set in stone.

Leaving you with five actual constructive "rules" out of seventeen that most cultures figured out without the Judaic or christian texts...


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post #63 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 01:11 PM
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Actually the first four commandments are all about appeasing God's ego, and the seven deadly sins represent some of humanity's defining traits which all contain constructive potential. The Honour thy father and thy mother commandment is potentially a recipe for child abuse and should not be a rule set in stone.

Leaving you with five actual constructive "rules" out of seventeen that most cultures figured out without the Judaic or christian texts...

Jesus says himself that the 10 commandments serves one purpose alone, and that is to teach love and respect for everyone. This is the one commandments I live by. And it is a difference between honour your parents and let yourself be abused by them.

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post #64 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 02:43 PM
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Actually the first four commandments are all about appeasing God's ego, and the seven deadly sins represent some of humanity's defining traits which all contain constructive potential. The Honour thy father and thy mother commandment is potentially a recipe for child abuse and should not be a rule set in stone.

Leaving you with five actual constructive "rules" out of seventeen that most cultures figured out without the Judaic or christian texts...
1) They were fashioned during a rather harsh time, one where control was required. Makes sense for whoever created them to establish the first few with the purpose of creating the foundation for following the proceeding commandments.

2) The seven deadly sins are called such because, if they become too pronounced, they can become detrimental to the individual and lead them astray from God. Has something to do with the Christian idea of death and how it's linked to a personal connection to God.

3) Honor, yes, but not allow to abuse. Really, this is something of a silly complain. Yes, it COULD allow for abuse, but most cultures have some rule that states that the child should at least listen to their parents. The commandments were, in my mind, all about establishing the bedrock for an at least somewhat orderly society. The rule probably had to do with maintaining the family unit.

With the coming of Christ we see the essential message of Christian teaching come through, which is the Golden Rule. Now, obviously religion can be abused and that can lead to all sorts of shit, but that one rule is

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post #65 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 03:54 PM
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Christianity is a sun worshipping religion, plagiarised from the melting pot of beliefs that was the Levant, following the persians, romans, greeks, cilicians, egyptians etc.

Of those religions, many of its greatest minds in philosophy and science were followers of their own religions, paying attention to 'divine edicts'. Almost uniquely in history, Christianity has been one of the few which has not majorly advanced itself massively in technology - it was called the dark ages for a reason. It wasn't until the church began to lose its power and control that it had during that period that advances happened.

Christianity as practised regressed the world, effecitvely.

In regards to the creation story - what need would a god have of days?



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post #66 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 04:02 PM
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The process isn't hard to figure out. There's just no way to conclusively prove it at this stage. Once carbon and water exist on the planet, more complex molecules are able to form, and from there even more can form as well. Eventually, simple molecular machines come to be, which will go on to combine into more complex molecular machines and eventually simple cells.

Simulations in a lab have shown it to be possible. And while yes, we cannot verify it historically for obvious reasons, scientifically it is infinitely more viable than the alternative.
But where would the carbon and water come from?

Where did the stuff that created the carbon and water come from?

You can't create something from nothing that violates the laws of thermodynamics.
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post #67 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 04:47 PM
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I find it to be much more sensible to answer that question with "We don't know yet" rather than "Some omnipotent immortal alien being created it for the SOLE benefit of HUMANS". Because I don't think that not knowing everything about reality itself is something to be ashamed of.

Certainly, Occam's Razor suggests that there is a better explanation for the creation of the universe than because "God exists, and he got bored".

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post #68 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 04:59 PM
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I find it to be much more sensible to answer that question with "We don't know yet" rather than "Some omnipotent immortal alien being created it for the SOLE benefit of HUMANS". Because I don't think that not knowing everything about reality itself is something to be ashamed of.

Certainly, Occam's Razor suggests that there is a better explanation for the creation of the universe than because "God exists, and he got bored".
That is why I have a problem with it. Things like genetics, thermodynamics, physics they all have undisputed proof, you can explain them to someone and successfully answer questions without using the "we don't know yet."

But someone evolution is a fact when there's plenty of flaws that would be more than enough to make anything else restricted to a theory until proven otherwise.
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post #69 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 05:57 PM
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Christianity is a sun worshipping religion, plagiarised from the melting pot of beliefs that was the Levant, following the persians, romans, greeks, cilicians, egyptians etc.



Of those religions, many of its greatest minds in philosophy and science were followers of their own religions, paying attention to 'divine edicts'. Almost uniquely in history, Christianity has been one of the few which has not majorly advanced itself massively in technology - it was called the dark ages for a reason. It wasn't until the church began to lose its power and control that it had during that period that advances happened.



Christianity as practised regressed the world, effecitvely.



In regards to the creation story - what need would a god have of days?

So Newton and Einstein work in science was regressed? Even Stephen Hawkings have never rejected the belief that there may be a God.


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But where would the carbon and water come from?

Where did the stuff that created the carbon and water come from?

You can't create something from nothing that violates the laws of thermodynamics.

Acctualy carbon and oxygen is created by Fusion within stars. And matter is only one state of enegy. Science have proven that a total vaccun is most likely impossible cause there is always energy left that can form matter in the state of particles which can in turn create atoms.

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post #70 of 130 (permalink) Old 08-17-14, 06:02 PM
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While still quite hypothetical, it might be the case that there is no 'nothing'. Not in the sense that we usually mean at least. Vacuum appears to have energy, and energy is certainly not nothing. We are still looking for a large amount of antimatter or an explanation for the lack thereof to explain the big bang, but matter and antimatter can come into existence. See it like this: if you are digging a hole on the beach, you are not only digging a hole, but a mound of sand as well, while first there was neither. That there are still some exciting questions in physics does not mean there's no answer for them. 'We don't know, therefore god' is not an answer that I am content with.
For a long time there were similar questions like "How can it be that positive and negatively charged materials attract eachother? That is action over distance! We don't know how it works!" But we now know that the electromagnetic force works by exchanging photons. Just because something seems impossible without magic, doesn't mean there's actually magic.

Edit: Ah, you were too fast for me Moriouce! Though Stephen Hawking does deny belief in God, as did Einstein. However, you can't disprove something that is constructed as such that it cannot be disproven. You cannot disprove god, no, but neither can you disprove an invisible, immeasureable omnipresent octopus.
Stephen Hawking on the matter:

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