The ethics of selling plasti-crack - Page 2 - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
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post #11 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-10-14, 07:56 PM
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I'll have to be the devil's advocate on this one. As for the unfortunate homeless man, as you said, its clear he has some mental issues. But at the end of the day if he wants to spend his money on plastic spacemen that is his business. I do not feel its the staff's responsibility to dissuade anyone from buying something. I will say that it is still a 'dickhead' move to try and convince him to buy something he couldn't afford and then offer no alternative other than 'go beg for more and come back'.

At the end of the day on a personal level the staff was probably being ignorant but from a business perspective -- no, they're doing their job. Their job isn't to dissuade anyone (sane or troubled) from buying something. And yes that is capitalism and greedy -- and there is nothing wrong with it.

The more serious issue has already been pointed out. That the unfortunate soul is begging for money to buy miniatures instead of food and shelter. He would be better served by receiving some help but some people do refuse it.
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post #12 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-10-14, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Angel of Lies View Post
I'll have to be the devil's advocate on this one. As for the unfortunate homeless man, as you said, its clear he has some mental issues. But at the end of the day if he wants to spend his money on plastic spacemen that is his business. I do not feel its the staff's responsibility to dissuade anyone from buying something. I will say that it is still a 'dickhead' move to try and convince him to buy something he couldn't afford and then offer no alternative other than 'go beg for more and come back'.

At the end of the day on a personal level the staff was probably being ignorant but from a business perspective -- no, they're doing their job. Their job isn't to dissuade anyone (sane or troubled) from buying something. And yes that is capitalism and greedy -- and there is nothing wrong with it.

The more serious issue has already been pointed out. That the unfortunate soul is begging for money to buy miniatures instead of food and shelter. He would be better served by receiving some help but some people do refuse it.
just imagine what the world would be coming to if everyone simply thought "its not my problem" "its his business"

everything is wrong with the level of greed where other people suffer the consequences. especially at the cost of those that already struggle for a roof over the head.

the staff behaved like first class shitstains, nothing else to it. the fact that they have a certain job does not absolve them from doing something unethical

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post #13 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-10-14, 08:32 PM
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On a side note, its GW staff we are talkng here. They are breed to be evil. They are grown feeding on the weak. They are Chosens of the Dark God (Khornepitalism). What should we expect from them??

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post #14 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-10-14, 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Angel of Lies View Post
I'll have to be ... do refuse it.
While I applaud you for taking up the adverse position, I have to disagree.
They are taking advantage of someone, if the situation as presented is to be believed. It is not just trying to get someones money, but actually encouraging someone with (perhaps minor) mental disabilities to ask for other peoples money for yourself. I can hardly believe that this isn't illegal in some way, not just being a part of male anatomy or excremental stain.
From a business perspective, I don't think the bad reputation you'll get this way is worth the alms of a homeless man. Bad press can have terrible consequences.

EDIT:
I'm terribly sorry, but I've misread the situation. I'll go leave and feel silly now.

Last edited by Tha Tall One; 08-11-14 at 06:48 AM.
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post #15 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-10-14, 09:00 PM
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On a side note, its GW staff we are talkng here. They are breed to be evil. They are grown feeding on the weak. They are Chosens of the Dark God (Khornepitalism). What should we expect from them??
That they are employees who are required to meet certain deadlines and requirements in order to keep their jobs, much less progress in them?

I don't think they're bred to be evil or greedy. I am unaware of how their business model works but I imagine their employees aren't exactly well-off. Again I speak from a position of ignorance on their pay scale but I'd assume minimum wage isn't too far off from the base employee. Management obviously has more pay and perks but I can't imagine its luxurious.

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just imagine what the world would be coming to if everyone simply thought "its not my problem" "its his business"

everything is wrong with the level of greed where other people suffer the consequences. especially at the cost of those that already struggle for a roof over the head.

the staff behaved like first class shitstains, nothing else to it. the fact that they have a certain job does not absolve them from doing something unethical
The world would have more privacy? I also don't see how them trying to sell him the plastic spacemen he wanted is unethical. Yes, the man does seem to have mental disabilities, but does that mean he doesn't get to exercise his right to buy something he wants, no matter nonessential it is for him?

As the OP presents the story the homeless man insisted that he wanted the more expensive kit and said he would go out and beg for enough to come back and buy it. Given that statement, the staff have no moral obligation to stop him.

And beyond that, how are they going to stop him? Demand that he not do so? What if he does anyway and comes back with the money and wants to buy it? Are they just suppose to tell him to go fuck off and refuse him service? You cannot discriminate just because he's homeless and obviously has no logical use for plastic spacemen.

We given that he is a recovering heroin addict and alcoholic perhaps this is his release valve? Instead of begging you for money only to spend it on getting high maybe buying these plastic spacemen is what keeps his mind from the cravings that all addicts (that I know) have?
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post #16 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-10-14, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Angel of Lies View Post
The world would have more privacy? I also don't see how them trying to sell him the plastic spacemen he wanted is unethical. Yes, the man does seem to have mental disabilities, but does that mean he doesn't get to exercise his right to buy something he wants, no matter nonessential it is for him?

As the OP presents the story the homeless man insisted that he wanted the more expensive kit and said he would go out and beg for enough to come back and buy it. Given that statement, the staff have no moral obligation to stop him.

And beyond that, how are they going to stop him? Demand that he not do so? What if he does anyway and comes back with the money and wants to buy it? Are they just suppose to tell him to go fuck off and refuse him service? You cannot discriminate just because he's homeless and obviously has no logical use for plastic spacemen.

We given that he is a recovering heroin addict and alcoholic perhaps this is his release valve? Instead of begging you for money only to spend it on getting high maybe buying these plastic spacemen is what keeps his mind from the cravings that all addicts (that I know) have?
This is absolutely true. This day and age, you're not allowed to tell someone "no, you shouldn't do that" and I've been brought up, and strongly believe in the phrase "don't tell others how to spend their money" but there is a moral line. As salesmen, and as members of the community, they can't tell someone "no". They should however, in this situation be able to dissuade this guy from buying the most expensive model there (or at least for him). If he's around a bit and you see him a lot as you've said, offer to help him out! Not by giving him money, but by offering to help him build the model and paint it for him and maybe sell it if he's willing (I know mentally ill people are hard to deal with, I do it every day!) but if he is, you could assist him in making money, and yourself of course (never do something you're good at for free, another phrase I've been brought up on!). Perhaps the GW staff should have offered this for him? I think so. They can't tell him "no" but they can offer a better solution... So can everyone at the store at the time instead of letting it happen.

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post #17 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-11-14, 12:16 AM
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No offense to anyone here, but I feel a few things must be said......

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Pure greed.
Is it Greed morfangdakka? Could what your witnessing simply be uneducated people who can only make good money by selling a product or working insane hours to make a good days tip?

It really comes down to what you require as an individual. Most of those people make their living suckering people like that for a few bucks. Honeswtly do not blame them, for at the end of the day they are no different from you or me expect in the methods they choose.

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The staff members did absolutely nothing to even discourage him. Bearing in mind this man struggles for a bed every night, is it really ethical to be selling him 50+ euro of plastic without a second thought?
Should he, he is doing the job he was hired for. Unethical yes! Possibly immoral, maybe? Necessary, absolutely! The homeless man is a struggling addict of heroin/alcohol you say; why do you feel sorry for him? If he chooses to let those people talk him into spending his wealthfare money then perhaps he should choose more wisely. Besides what would you rather have McMuffin? A guy spending your tax money on Warhammer miniatures that could become a cure for his addiction, or a guy who takes your money and keeps buying hostel services, Booze, and Drugs? Personally I'll taske the former.

His money, his choice, he bears the consequences. It's Life, suck it up!

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Dublin is facing a serious plague of homelessness and poverty among inner city communities, largely down to substance and alcohol abuse, and if you actually walk around the city you'd definitely see evidence of it, even in so called high-street areas.
AHAHAHAHA, LOL. Welcome to the world dude, even in beautiful Downtown Boston, Ma, USA we see this stuff.

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a serious plague of homelessness and poverty among inner city communities,
Sadly it's the drugs man. alcohol's always been a factor, but with the spread of the Heroin Plague every city in the world is seeing this. We need to find the Heroin Cartels and kill them all.....seriously before it get completely out of hand.



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post #18 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-11-14, 12:27 AM
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Maybe the employees knew this guy wasn't actually homeless and was a frequent customer? There is no shortage of "homeless" people around here that are clearly not. They get money from people and spend it on whatever they want.

I don't begrudge the people doing that any more than the people taking their money for whatever they want to buy.

Besides, if this guy spends it on GW stuff and then goes back out to take more free money to manage a nights sleep indoors that's HIS decision.

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post #19 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-11-14, 12:59 AM
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Besides, if this guy spends it on GW stuff and then goes back out to take more free money to manage a nights sleep indoors that's HIS decision.
The question is begged; if he can get more money is it still unethical?

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The more serious issue has already been pointed out. That the unfortunate soul is begging for money to buy miniatures instead of food and shelter.
Indeed, the problem lies with his poor decision making than anything else. Why not choose to buy food, shelter, and clothing instead of walking into a store to beg for change he obviously spent on wasteful products?



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post #20 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-11-14, 02:00 PM
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Drugs don't make you smarter.

Unless you're Bradley Cooper or Scarlett Johansson.

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