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post #241 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 10:11 AM
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Spain has many many guns, and even more swords, knives etc as they are totally unregulated. We don't have the same number of deaths from guns as the US and lower knife deaths than the UK. We also are poorer than either country, by quite a long way. What we do have here is a couple of things I'm thinking that helps:
1 - We have less violence on TV than UK or US, much less...
2 - We have more sex on TV than UK or US, much more...
3 - We have more family strength, community feeling and less fear of our neighbours...
4 - We have more of a "everyone to their own" attitude, more laws but less interference in the lives day by day of the peoples...

I would like to see study done to see link between violence in media compared to violence on streets, and the same with sex, I thinking more sex makes less violence ;)

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post #242 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 10:13 AM
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Here is my take on it,

The irony is you dont need to BAN guns.... just HAND GUNS!

Thus the precious (over interpreted 2nd amendment is safe!) - with your right to bear arms already limited - i.e. your not allowed a rocket launcher or 109mm cannon and shells - hand-guns should also be on that list.

The U.S. could try a buy back program, armistice and then Get the police in - get a crack-down going.... clean up the streets.

If you want a gun, sure, but its only gonna be a rifle or shot-gun, and even then there should be a license to own, where you are trained (at your cost) at a police firearms range.

Obviously military / ex-military would already have a said license.

Remember with great power comes great responsibility.... blah blah blah.... your responsibility to your fellow countryman - that is what a community is.

if you are afraid you need a gun, as B&K stated earlier.... you are in the wrong place!
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post #243 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 10:16 AM
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I don't think people will switch to knives. Most gun crime, as the graphs above might indicate, is gang-related. I don't see crypts and bloods doing knife-bys or waging war in the streets with knives. I do, however, see them obtaining guns from elsewhere, or failing that, making their own weapons. I can't say it would be too hard to hire gun runners from Mexico. Hell, they already do. And who is to say that just because they can't shoot each other any more they won't just molotov entire neighborhoods instead of doing drivebys, or plant homemade bombs, or just resort to arson? Removing the guns may indeed simply lead to a violent and bloody arms race for the few they can get their hands on. Organized and gang-related crime must be stamped out. Find a way to get rid of that, and you get rid of 99% of the problem.

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post #244 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 10:20 AM
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@Gret79

if you look at this PIE (compiled by the FBI)




Of all homicides in the US, only 12% are carried out by Knives.

66.9% of all homicides are executed by fire-arms, over three quarters of that are by hand-guns! In fact Rifles and shotguns homicides added together are less than the deaths caused by knives.
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post #245 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 10:23 AM Thread Starter
nice boy, daft though !
 
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Originally Posted by Corporal Punishment 69 View Post
Spain has many many guns, and even more swords, knives etc as they are totally unregulated. We don't have the same number of deaths from guns as the US and lower knife deaths than the UK. We also are poorer than either country, by quite a long way. What we do have here is a couple of things I'm thinking that helps:
1 - We have less violence on TV than UK or US, much less...
2 - We have more sex on TV than UK or US, much more...
3 - We have more family strength, community feeling and less fear of our neighbours...
4 - We have more of a "everyone to their own" attitude, more laws but less interference in the lives day by day of the peoples...

I would like to see study done to see link between violence in media compared to violence on streets, and the same with sex, I thinking more sex makes less violence ;)
yeah but you did go about killing each other for best part of 30 years after that little thing Franco caused back in the 30's, what was the toll 465000?



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post #246 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zetronus View Post
Here is my take on it,

The irony is you dont need to BAN guns.... just HAND GUNS!

Thus the precious (over interpreted 2nd amendment is safe!) - with your right to bear arms already limited - i.e. your not allowed a rocket launcher or 109mm cannon and shells - hand-guns should also be on that list.

The U.S. could try a buy back program, armistice and then Get the police in - get a crack-down going.... clean up the streets.

If you want a gun, sure, but its only gonna be a rifle or shot-gun, and even then there should be a license to own, where you are trained (at your cost) at a police firearms range.

Obviously military / ex-military would already have a said license.

Remember with great power comes great responsibility.... blah blah blah.... your responsibility to your fellow countryman - that is what a community is.

if you are afraid you need a gun, as B&K stated earlier.... you are in the wrong place!
Guns aren't only there to defend against other people. In fact, that wasn't the purpose at all. They were meant to make every citizen a member of a standing militia, much like how Switzerland is organized today. That fell apart though mostly due to a lack of self-policing throughout the 1800s which demanded a formal police force throughout the 1900s, as well as ever-growing legislation and regulation of firearms.

Licensing is in effect a breach of a right (If you need permission to do it, it is no longer a right, but a privilege). However, there is a much better, more effective, and all-inclusive way of going about it. When you turn 18, you are issued a card from the federal government saying you are of upstanding legal status and acceptable moral fiber. This operates like a drivers license. Too many punches, and it becomes void. Vendors may not sell to anyone without a valid card, and they must track every single sale they make meticulously, taking names and social security numbers. Failure to do so results in revocation and confiscation. Extreme, but necessary. If it is discovered that someone is being a middle-man, as in, buying legally from a vendor then selling illegally, they are imprisoned, everything they have is confiscated, and their card is revoked indefinitely. That card can also be used for other dangerous things as well that you normally wouldn't want a criminal getting their hands on, but an average person might want, such as ammunition. In addition this is also your voters registration card. Criminals aren't allowed to vote either. This will hopefully help keep politicians from pandering.

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post #247 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 10:26 AM
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@Iron Angel

Irony would be that crime is perpetrated by criminals. The point that people don't want to see is that simply hand-guns are too dangerous.

For every fatality with a firearm there are two non-fatal survivors, if you have a look at the economic cost of this as a society - its certainly an eye-opener.

While there is some truth to saying you cannot stop a determined individual - it doesn't mean

1. you shouldn't try
2. not find ways to limit their impact.
3. not to asses the problem for what it is


[edit]
Now thats interesting, I like the idea of a card, similar to a driving license - as that to many points and the card is revoked...

but what about training... arguably one can go to a store - buy a gun / rifle without ANY training on its use!?

Last edited by Zetronus; 07-24-12 at 10:32 AM.
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post #248 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 10:27 AM
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yeah but you did go about killing each other for best part of 30 years after that little thing Franco caused back in the 30's, what was the toll 465000?

And he die in 1975, since then Spain change muchly, you also had bloody civil war, just more time ago, this have nothing to do with how is Spain today. Also the killing of the Franco time was done by police and judges, not by the everyday peoples, it was a dictator who make rule by terror, not relevant at all to what I say.....

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post #249 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 10:31 AM Thread Starter
nice boy, daft though !
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zetronus View Post
@Gret79

if you look at this PIE (compiled by the FBI)




Of all homicides in the US, only 12% are carried out by Knives.

66.9% of all homicides are executed by fire-arms, over three quarters of that are by hand-guns! In fact Rifles and shotguns homicides added together are less than the deaths caused by knives.
12% of an average of 10k murders a year works out at 1200 knife murders, which is six times the number of that of the UK, so per capita its similar, Yes the UK stats show our knife crime has ballooned in recent years, but what people are forgetting is its ballooned because you get arrested for looking at a knife in the UK, Because in the UK we said "hey you little fuckers who keep stabbing each other, we are not standing for that shit,if we catch you in possession of a knife your going to the big house", Its what we call change to the law in an attempt to reduce further crimes being committed.
Ok it means i cant walk the streets with a knife like i used to (yeah thats right i carry a knife, not for self defence, but because its part of a multitool which is a tool with many useful functions other than death and murder) but thats a price im willing to pay a legal knife owner for the safety of other people. Im aware can still be stabbed or robbed/raped at knife point on the street or in my own home,but i avoid conflicts and known dangerous areas and i lock my doors and windows. If i felt i needed a weapons to feel safe in my day to day living i would leave the area i inhabited and if that was my entire nation i would move to another country.



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post #250 of 386 (permalink) Old 07-24-12, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Corporal Punishment 69 View Post
not relevant at all to what I say.....
You'll get used to that, people love taking things with no relevance and making it relevant and sticking to it.
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