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  Topic Review (Newest First)
08-17-10 04:11 AM
5tonsledge yea buddy only 1 dedicated transport per unit and combat squads are only 1 unit so you cant duoble up on transports.
08-17-10 04:03 AM
dewn_moutain some games i do put a guy up top, cuz on the base of the SM is the squad designation on it.

i have a rhino, a razorback, and 4 raiders (yeah, its nuts). each thing has a different part thats either painted weird or missing a part (ive had my army 12 years now...)
08-17-10 03:10 AM
VanitusMalus What I did with similar transport vehicles is mark them with a number from your transfer sheet or in the case of eldar vary the pattern up a bit or even mark them with symbols. This is just best to avoid the scenario Jimboz described, because it's true I have seen that happen many times also. Or the worse when a guy has like 4 wave serpents all painted the same colour, before the game starts he tells you what's in each and then plays full card monty with them so by the time they're exiting, being blown up, what have you, you have no idea what unit was in what wave serpent.
08-17-10 02:14 AM
ChaosSpaceMarineGuy First of all, I apologize for the outburst. I have no problem with revealing for tournament rules. I have my vehicles painted differently (I couldn't come to a decision until recently on legion I want to play) so as long as I have which unit is in which colored vehicle, as well with HQs, written down on my list then I don't see why my opponent would have a problem with that.
08-16-10 07:22 PM
JimbozGrapes I think the biggest issue here is the matter of cheating. I play eldar, and the wave serpent (our dedicated transport) can carry a very vast number of models. I could have 3 wave serpents all with the same weapons and upgrades, and easly cheat. Okay so my first wave serpent gets destroyed, that one now is holding useless troops, but the one he didnt attack gets to now hold my fire dragons.

Okay so he moved his tank closer to my wave serpent that was holding DA's a second ago, you get to know have my Anti-tank troupes. So on and so on. It would just be much to easy to exploit in tournaments, and when it comes to being competitive, a lot of people will do anything to win. Heck a lot of people put a lot of time into this game, they would love to win.

If its with your friends, your obviously (hopefully) not going to cheat, then power to you, would be fun with secrecy and adding a whole new aspect to the game.

However, in any other situation, as a simplicity of stopping cheaters, full disclosure must unfortunately be in affect. Anything that can lead to potentially easy cheating has to be blatant to not favor the cheaters.

08-11-10 01:30 PM
Originally Posted by don_mondo View Post
But the default is what's in the transport is revealed. There's even a suggestion (yes, just a suggestion) on page 64 that you put a model from the transported unit on top of the transport. So there's RAI right in the rulebook....................
You even have to announce which units are embarked in which transports when you declare the disposition of your reserves.
08-11-10 01:16 PM
Originally Posted by dewn_moutain View Post
don, 25 years? really? nice. i was at fort bragg.

... .
Bragg, huh? I'm sorry. I was there TDY twice, both times for boards. First time I show up, rental car authorized, and Bragg says OK, here's a CUCV (Blazer), that's your rental car. Second time the airline lost my luggage. So I'm sitting on the board the next day in bluejeans and t-shirt. I think it was a bit disconcerting for some of the soldiers appearing before the board.................

Anyways, I was just repeating what someone else had already pointed out earlier in the thread, so he gets credit for being 'first'. But yeah, this is a long standing debate. And sure, sometimes it is fun to run everything secret. But the default is what's in the transport is revealed. There's even a suggestion (yes, just a suggestion) on page 64 that you put a model from the transported unit on top of the transport. So there's RAI right in the rulebook....................
08-11-10 02:12 AM
dewn_moutain alright, kids are in bed. whew...

so, don did point out to me what the "to keep things fair" part of the paragraph was in relation to, and how it affected "the spirit of". So i am man enough to say thanks for pointing that out to me.

And, to keep this from spinning around and around and around....

yes, in all fairness, open disclosure, in tournament setting, is the way to go.

yet, the last sentence of the paragraph in question quite simply says "the choice is yours". so, If im at my friends house, drinking some beers and playing the game, we will keep the rosters to ourselves and try to outwit each other. If im at the local game store, playing for fun, ill ask my opponent, since its a two way street for good sportsmanship.

Now, for my next question,

whats the deal for the bolter? whats the story behind it? If you have any knowledge about it, i threw up a post (it didnt taste well) in the fluff section...

08-11-10 01:31 AM
dewn_moutain don, 25 years? really? nice. i was at fort bragg.

hmmmmm.... i see your point don. makes sense now. thanks.

crap...id say more, but its the kids bed time....
08-10-10 11:16 AM
Originally Posted by dewn_moutain View Post
ok, so i got home, and after spending some time with the family, i pulled out the bible and paged through it, referencing the pages deathscythe stated. pg 94 states that you need to declare if your transports ARE transporting anyone, and if a independent character is attaching to a unit or not.
page 92 states says alot of things, but ill hit the key points of discussion.
first line, "... you SHOULD (not must) always allow your opponent to read your force roster AFTER (not before) a game. In the SAME SPIRIT (not have to), always make clear to your opponent which squads are embarked in which transport vehicle." blah blah blah, more fluff, "...Some players PREFER {not demand or have a right to} full disclosure (which is the norm at tournaments, for example), as they want to outmaneuver the enemy rather than spring a secret trump. Others prefer secrecy around lists, as bluffing can make the game really entertaining."

And now, here is something i need to point out, so i shall make it in bold, caps, and add some faces to it to emphasize the importance of this statement


So, what it all boils down to.... [drum roll]

...is whether or not you wish to show off your super awesome force or if you want to be all secret squirrel.

myself, when i deploy, i dont want to see a persons list. and i dont give out my list. ill tell the guy/girl if i am exactly at X amount or under it by so many, just to let them know its kosher, but thats it. the only thing i want to know from my opponent is the army and how close they are to points. Heck, when we deploy, if i go first, ill deploy, and then turn my back while they set up, so that its a true surprise to me.

but hey, i want to shouts out to everyone who chimed in with advice. thanks for the points of views, and the info i needed. i look forward to posting my next question.
Exept you left off the first part of the first line, "To keep things fair", which is what the "In the same spirit" refers to. It does not refer to the "should" or "after the game". It refers to the first part of the sentence, "To keep things fair". Kills your whole argument, doesn't it? To repeat, in the same spirit is NOT referring to after the game or any such, it's refering to "To keep things fair". And there is no wiggle room for choosing in the line regarding transports. "always make clear". No "should", no choice, just "always". So no, by the rules, there is no choice.
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