Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums - Reply to Topic
Thread: 2k: Iyanden + Firebase Cadre Reply to Thread
Title:
Message:
Trackback:
Send Trackbacks to (Separate multiple URLs with spaces) :
Post Icons
You may choose an icon for your message from the following list:
 

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










  Additional Options
Miscellaneous Options

  Topic Review (Newest First)
01-26-14 06:33 PM
Ragewind
Quote:
You're throwing a very specific example out to counter this list; I know Tau is usually heavy on anti-air, but how many armies do you know that's carrying that many anti-air units for FMCs? Two Riptides, a flier, and massive quantity of autocannons rerolling their snapshots SHOULD handle anything. In your Monster mash example, each dead Demon is worth a good chunk of their arm
That may be a specific example, but its an example that people run. If you go out to do something say a tourney and you run into a list like that, you will basically auto lose. That is not the hallmark of a balanced list.
It doesn't have to be chaos demons, it can be a Tyrant with a 2+ jink thanks to Shroud, it can be a 2+ cover and 30+ wounds Grotesque squad running at you, it can be a single unit of Harlequins backed by fortune or even a Dark Angel 4+ invul Tri landraider list etc etc. You don't have a way to strip cover nor do you have a way to >at least< tie something big up. If nothing else Tank Traps would completely prevent you being rushed by armor.

Quote:
Again, you seem to be focusing on what a Demons of Chaos list will do... have you had bad experiences with them? I like to build my list for all comers, and it feels foolish to kit out the Wraithknight for close combat when nothing else in the army is built for it, just in case I get a death star coming at me. Besides, in a situation like that I can do the same thing that you suggested against me; overwhelming firepower. Each squad of Broadsides can unleash 18 shots a turn, and I have 4 of those squads.
Two bright lances will glance AV 14 on a 4. Two Wraithcannons will glance AV 14 on a 4.....I wasen't asking you to give up on his firepower, i was asking you to give him a Invul save so he can tank certain types of hits in CC. The 4+ invul power from the BRB is better, but my example is cheaper than giving him a Suncannon. See above for the remainder.

Quote:
Really not interested in Fortifications. Anything a Riptide can do to me, I can do to it
That not exactly true. While your own riptides can and will play with enemy riptides thanks to JsJ, your broadsides cannot. The best you can do is park them in a 4+ save area. If you are fighting enemy Tau they can not only strip your cover but their blast will isnta kill almost a 200 point unit a turn, and those broadsides cannot fight back when they JsJ out of LOS. You of course don't have to take a fortification, but when your enemy does and it lets them win the game what are you going to do? Void Sheilds clearly won't stand against your mass of Tank Hunters Str 7, but something like a Macro Cannon which is AV 15 will. Even your Wraithcannons are glancing on a 5+, but a simple Landing Pad will do a lot for the enemy, or even something large like a Fortress will allow the enemy to Jsj out of LOS where you have nothing to hurt him but static SMS. Any sort of out of LOS barrage is going to ruin your day.

Quote:
The Advent Calender Dataslates that GW sold. They had a few doozies of Formations, including the Firebase Support Cadre and the Astartes Storm Win
Thats really cool, I will have to take a look at it.

Quote:
The Fusion Blasters on the Riptides are more there because I might get a Heldrake or Stormraven flying in, and I want to pop S12 armor on a flier. I have 12 SMS already on all the broadsides to deal with cover if needed, and they don't synch very well with the Ion Accelerators.
Yes of course you are correct, but the Broadsides won't be moving much, if at all, and the Riptides will. Other than your bikes you don't have much to fear from Helldrakes because of all your 2+ armor, and a Storm Raven is immune to melta. In my suggestion you can move your riptides up and hunt people who are hiding behind cover and out of range of the broadsides. I would give it a shot both ways and see what you need the most.
01-26-14 01:59 PM
Xabre
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragewind View Post
So basically other than the riptides and a single AV 10 flyer you don't have much to stop even Hive Tyrants much less multiple Nurgle daemons with 2+ jink save. Or perhaps a Screamerstar, the list isn't bad at all but what to do when you run up against a particularly resilient enemy?

You're throwing a very specific example out to counter this list; I know Tau is usually heavy on anti-air, but how many armies do you know that's carrying that many anti-air units for FMCs? Two Riptides, a flier, and massive quantity of autocannons rerolling their snapshots SHOULD handle anything. In your Monster mash example, each dead Demon is worth a good chunk of their army.


As it stands even a mounted Seer Council can not only reach you quickly, but dismantle your army piece by piece.

I would consider giving the Knight 2 Bright lances, and the sword+sheild and give the Farseer the Wraithforge gem, that way you can at least tie up super units like the Screamer star and heal off wounds allowing you to dismantle the rest of the list.

Again, you seem to be focusing on what a Demons of Chaos list will do... have you had bad experiences with them? I like to build my list for all comers, and it feels foolish to kit out the Wraithknight for close combat when nothing else in the army is built for it, just in case I get a death star coming at me. Besides, in a situation like that I can do the same thing that you suggested against me; overwhelming firepower. Each squad of Broadsides can unleash 18 shots a turn, and I have 4 of those squads.

I would also look at getting something other than just a 2+ armor save or a 4+ cover save, especially since a enemy Riptide could instakill a squad of broadsides each turn PER riptide. A landing pad or some void sheilds would go a long way to keeping you alive.

Really not interested in Fortifications. Anything a Riptide can do to me, I can do to it.


I don't know anything about formations though, Tank hunters on all that Str 7 sounds amazing, what book is that from.

The Advent Calender Dataslates that GW sold. They had a few doozies of Formations, including the Firebase Support Cadre and the Astartes Storm Wing.

Edit: Because you have all that Tank Hunters you don't need a Fusion blaster on those Riptides, a SMS would be better for people cowering out of LOS like enemy Jetbikers.

The Fusion Blasters on the Riptides are more there because I might get a Heldrake or Stormraven flying in, and I want to pop S12 armor on a flier. I have 12 SMS already on all the broadsides to deal with cover if needed, and they don't synch very well with the Ion Accelerators.
01-26-14 10:22 AM
The Irish Commissar Also you can you the mantle from codex eldar with iyanden supplement your just not allowed mix and match on the same guy. so no mantle and spear but yes to mantle by itself
01-26-14 05:45 AM
Ragewind
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xabre View Post
Well, in your example, there's 2 riptides w/ skyfire and Interceptor, firing S7 ap2 shots around, not to mention a flier. The rest need to snap shot, but sheer weight of firepower should let me ground MCs.

As for the Crisis Suits, doing that requires me to use allies, not formations. That means an HQ, troops, etc. The Formation grants everything Tank Hunter and PE: Marines, and Marines gets Hatred against them.
So basically other than the riptides and a single AV 10 flyer you don't have much to stop even Hive Tyrants much less multiple Nurgle daemons with 2+ jink save. Or perhaps a Screamerstar, the list isn't bad at all but what to do when you run up against a particularly resilient enemy?

As it stands even a mounted Seer Council can not only reach you quickly, but dismantle your army piece by piece.

I would consider giving the Knight 2 Bright lances, and the sword+sheild and give the Farseer the Wraithforge gem, that way you can at least tie up super units like the Screamer star and heal off wounds allowing you to dismantle the rest of the list.

I would also look at getting something other than just a 2+ armor save or a 4+ cover save, especially since a enemy Riptide could instakill a squad of broadsides each turn PER riptide. A landing pad or some void sheilds would go a long way to keeping you alive.

I don't know anything about formations though, Tank hunters on all that Str 7 sounds amazing, what book is that from.

Edit: Because you have all that Tank Hunters you don't need a Fusion blaster on those Riptides, a SMS would be better for people cowering out of LOS like enemy Jetbikers.
01-26-14 04:19 AM
Xabre Well, in your example, there's 2 riptides w/ skyfire and Interceptor, firing S7 ap2 shots around, not to mention a flier. The rest need to snap shot, but sheer weight of firepower should let me ground MCs.

As for the Crisis Suits, doing that requires me to use allies, not formations. That means an HQ, troops, etc. The Formation grants everything Tank Hunter and PE: Marines, and Marines gets Hatred against them.
01-26-14 01:44 AM
Ragewind So what would you do against a chaos deamon army that featured 3-5 flying MC's along with one of those Shreiker units that have the re-roll on the 2+ invuls? You can toss on multiple fast rending troops as well.

Although the troops of course would be destroyed almost instantly by the amount of Broadsides.


Of course for nearly 40 points less you can take Crisis suits who have the same weapons. Although I have been out of it lately, perhaps there is a special rule somewhere for these fire-base formations?>
01-25-14 02:03 PM
Xabre Tiny edit... Any other thoughts?


Primary Detachment: Iyanden Eldar (794)

Farseer - 130 pts
on Jetbike, Spear of Teuthlas

Windrider Jetbike Squadron - 61
x3, Cannon

Windrider Jetbike Squadron - 61
x3, Cannon

Windrider Jetbike Squadron - 61
x3, Cannon

Windrider Jetbike Squadron - 61
x3, Cannon

Crimson Hunter - 180
Exarch, x2 Lances

Wraithknight - 240 (Warlord)
x2 Heavy Cannons

Formation: Firebase Support Cadre (600)

Riptide - 210
TL Fusion, Ion Accel, EWO, VT

Broadside Team - 195
x3 HYMP

Broadside Team - 195
x3 HYMP

Formation: Firebase Support Cadre (600)

Riptide - 210
TL Fusion, Ion Accel, EWO, VT

Broadside Team - 195
x3 HYMP

Broadside Team - 195
x3 HYMP
01-20-14 04:28 PM
Xabre The problem there is that Iyanden doesn't allow the Mantle, and I went with Iyanden in order to Warlord the WK.

Option A) Use the Wk-lord, and a jetseer throwing around Divination.

Option B) Warlord a mantletarch.
01-20-14 03:11 PM
w0lfgang7 I thought about the autarch also. Drop 2 SC from the windriders and that will give you the 150 points you need to make a nice laughtarch.

===

I like your list BTW
01-20-14 04:15 AM
Xabre I rather like that idea. I'm almost tempted to use an autarch to control them and the Hunter hitting the board, but having a Jetseer for rerolling Riptides seems pretty useful.
This thread has more than 10 replies. Click here to review the whole thread.

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome