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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-09-09, 05:23 PM Thread Starter
 
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Default 2250 Lizardmen

This is the new list I'll be using since the new Lizardmen book came out. Tell me what you guys think. I think it will be a pretty solid list, and I know it will have issues with Magic heavy lists, and gun lines, but who doesn't have issues with gun lines?

Lord – Saurus Old Blood
-Hide Of The Old Ones
-The Maiming Shield
-Carnosaur Pendant
245pts

Hero – Saurus Scar-Veteran
-Shield Of The Mirrored Pool
-Burning Blade Of Chotec
-Light Armour
140pts

Hero – Gor-Rok 215pts

Core – Saurus Warriors with Spears x24
-Champion
-Standard Bearer
-Musician
318pts

Core – Saurus Warriors
x24
-Champion
-Standard Bearer
-Musician
294pts

Core – Saurus Warriors x24
-Champion
-Standard Bearer
-Musician
294pts

Core – Skinks x10 80pts

Special – Saurus Cold One Cavalry x10
-Musician
-Champion
-Standard Bearer
-Huanchi's Blessed Totem
425 pts

Stegadon - 235pts

Army Total is 2246

Last edited by Grik; 02-09-09 at 05:33 PM.
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-09-09, 07:09 PM
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I'd written out a huge fucking post when the computer just crashed on me, losing everything I'd just written, so I'm sorry if any comments seem unduly harsh, or a bit snappy, Grik, don't worry it's not at you ;)

First off, the Old Blood - you have two Magic Armours there. Regardless of that, one thing I'm not keen on either is the LD8, despite the Cold Blooded, and your general acting stupid, and I'm extremely loath to put the best fighter in my army into a Position where although causing fear, and T6 may be good, he's still going to get mown down by the dedicated Killers.

The Carnosaur Pendant is a nifty little thing. Personally, though, I prefer the real thing on your Old Blood. The army has the same Leadership all the time, unless you took the Stegadon Helm. Which I won't recommend, if you've gone for Saurus Based.

Put him on a Carnosaur, and have him trundle up behind the Cold One Cavalry (lose A LOT of your points from this unit, 175pts has gone into +1 Combat Resolution, and as such, despite being less than 75pts off the 2250 limit on top of the 2000 list with that unit, has little in the way of effectiveness. Take 5, don't bother with Huanchi (although nice, keep it for a second unit) and go for the plain and simple War Banner.

You Old Blood shouls be equipped on Carnosaur in one of Several ways. Many go for the Instant Kill of the Blade of Realities. Others go for the Character/Beasty Killing Bane Head/Pirahna Blade (4 wounds for each unsaved wound vs. Targetted model). Myself, I'm a fan of the Blade of Tzunki. Gives you Strength 6, and Ignore Armour. Combined with the Str 7 Carnosaur, you can use that as the Anti armour, which is limited to some Slann spells, Stegadon Bolt Throwers, and Kroxigor, and none of those are as effective vs. the big Beasties, like Kholek. You can then choose the Bane Head, or Glyph Necklace (I prefer the Necklace, as a 2+/5++ Save is too good to pass up), and can last longer against the opponent, where the Toughness and number of High Strength/Armour ignoring attacks.

For 488pts, that Oldblood was able to kill Archaon 3/5 if he got the Charge on Archaon on his own, and 1/3 if he was in a unit. Conversely, about 2 seconds, if Archaon got the Charge with a unit, but such is the price.

Mirrored Pool Shield is goood ;) Nice Choice.

Gor'Rok? Easily my favourite special character, followed closely by Tetto'eko.

Your core choices.

Should ALWAYS BE SPEARS. I cannot stress how important this is - it's a lesson learnt from many Chaos Warriors games, when lack of diversity killed my unit (only taking Great Weapons, and ignoring the shields either getting me shot, or Charged by Heavy Cavalry). The cost of Saurus, although Cheaper than Chaos Warriors, are limited by their weapon options, and low WS/I. Make the most of a huge number of attacks, that the Spears give you. I've seen the units of 21 do well with Spears. Against the cheap hordes, the 7x3 Blocks grant 28 attacks at Str 4. As they have shields, you can also choose to adopt the 5x4+1 with +4 Minimum SCR, maybe even +5 for outnumber, as few units strong enough to take them on with any decent chance will be expensive.

Champions I find aren't required. More people will issue challenges with their Champions/Characters to stop the damage caused by the extra attack coming their way, which racks up it's totals over a few games, provided they aren't challenged. 28 attacks is more than enough as well, IMHO.

Not such a fan of Skink Skirmishers. I prefer the Invulnerable Kroxigors, and are the Real Anti-armour, and you still have a semi effective poisoned S+S reaction. 16 with 2 Krox gives you +3 Rank Bonus. You're only US 18 as well, so no Autobreak. Unless some rare person takes 5 Dragon Ogres and gives casts Slaaneshi Fear on them. *cough*.


I'm still not sold on the Saurus. They only real advantage they have over the Krox is +1 LD, +1 Movement, Strike in Initiative Order, and cheaper. All of which is offset by the Greater number of High Attacks, (still only a measly Str 6, but still, other than Magic items/spells and Monstrous Mounts, the best Anti-armour in the list), Greater Frontage for holding Flanks, cheaper overall cost (175pts minimum, in addition to perhaps a Command and Magic Banner, compared to 165, and that's it).

Anyway, Instead of 165 for For 3, get 2 and a fully ranked unit for 200pts.

I'd also recomment getting some Razordons - far more effective on the defence than a Stegadon, despite the gorgeousness of the model.



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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-09-09, 09:58 PM Thread Starter
 
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So what's the issue with having two armours? One is a shield and one is an actual suit of armour. I haven't really played a game since 5th, and haven't really studied the new 7th Ed book, just browsed it really, is that item combo not allowed anymore?
As for sticking him on a Carnosaur, I thought about that too, and I may do that after I play a couple games with this list. As for Spears, I really like them and I may actually change them to all having spears, just wanted to try it this way first.
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-09-09, 10:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Grik View Post
So what's the issue with having two armours? One is a shield and one is an actual suit of armour.
I'm pretty sure that 7th edition rules allow for only one magic armor per character, where armor is defined as shield, helm, OR chestpiece. You can mix the magic item with any combination of mundanes, but only one armor piece.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-09-09, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Othiem View Post
I'm pretty sure that 7th edition rules allow for only one magic armor per character, where armor is defined as shield, helm, OR chestpiece. You can mix the magic item with any combination of mundanes, but only one armor piece.
Othiem is right, in 7th Edition, you are limited to a single piece of magical armour. Same with weapons. I know that it sounds stupid, but thats the way it works now.

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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-09-09, 10:49 PM
 
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Alrighty, you've heard Vaz, now lemme try with my own assistance

Lord – Saurus Old Blood
-Hide Of The Old Ones
-The Maiming Shield
-Carnosaur Pendant
245pts


Personally with this guy, if you still want him to have a ridiculous save, I'd ditch the Hide of the Old Ones in favor of a Cold One. Still gives +2 to your save, still gives Fear, still gives Stupidity. Granted, you lose out on the +1 T, but you gain +3 Movement, and an extra WS3, S4 attack. That and an extra 20 some odd points to mess with. Depending on the other armies around/ personal preference, I'd say either a Sword of Striking, or a Sword of the Hornet. Oh, and you can slap light armor on this guy now! Well so much for those 20 extra points...

New cost: 260 pts
Lost: +1 T
Gained: +3 Move, +1 WS3 ST4 attack, +1 AS (total of a +0), +1 to hit OR Always Strikes First

Hero – Saurus Scar-Veteran
-Shield Of The Mirrored Pool
-Burning Blade Of Chotec
-Light Armour
140pts


Would probably ditch the Burning Blade on this guy. Unless ridiculously heavy armor, or regen is running rampant in your play group, you could probably just switch it to a different weapon. To keep with the idea though, could give him a Sword of Might for the same cost.

New Cost: Same
Lost: -1 to enemy AS
Gained: +1 S

Hero – Gor-Rok 215pts

Nothing to say to this guy really...

Core – Saurus Warriors with Spears x24
-Champion
-Standard Bearer
-Musician
318pts


These guys are good, nothing to add here.

Core – Saurus Warriors x24
-Champion
-Standard Bearer
-Musician
294pts


Add spears. If Vaz can preach anything, it is to add spears.

New Cost: 318 pts
Gained: Spears

Core – Saurus Warriors x24
-Champion
-Standard Bearer
-Musician
294pts


I'm voting to switch these guys out for the skinks. Just keep reading.

New Cost: 0 pts
Lost: This unit

Core – Skinks x10 80pts

Eh, with only 10 of these guys, can't say I'm really feeling it. And why are they 80 pts? 10 normal skinks would cost you 50, whereas the skirmishers would bump it up to 70. If you gave them javelins and shields instead, then we'd be on target, but still I feel it's not need for this few. I'd vote to switch out one of the Saurus's for a fully loaded Skink regiment of 25 with a pair of Kroxigors riding in the 2nd rank. A little less tougher, but faster, with a shielded big brother in the ranks.

New Cost: 257 pts
Lost: 24 Saurus Spearmen w/ full Command
Gained: 25 Skinks w/ full Command +2 Kroxigors.

Special – Saurus Cold One Cavalry x10
-Musician
-Champion
-Standard Bearer
-Huanchi's Blessed Totem
425 pts


Dunno about these guys. If you go with the Cold One mounted Lord, you could ditch a rider and the Huanchi's Blessed Totem in this squad and add in a Sun Standard of Chotec. Trust me on this one, these guys are arrow magnets, so every little bit can help.

New Cost: 405 pts
Lost: 1 rider, Huanchi's Blessed Totem
Gained: Sun Standard of Chotec

Stegadon - 235pts

Not much to say really. Your Rare choice is always a matter of personal preference. He could do awesome for you, or might not do a damned thing. In case of awesome though (and since the new model looks badass), I'd say keep him in and try him out.

Army Total: 2246


New Army Total: 2148 (Blarg, forgot about Gor-Rok!)

So that frees up 102 points for the 2250 target. Add a guy or two somewhere, or take away a thing or two elsewhere to add in something else coughdispelscrollskinkcough.

Last edited by Blind Cougar; 02-09-09 at 11:47 PM.
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-09-09, 10:57 PM Thread Starter
 
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Crap only one piece of magic armour is kinda stupid. I see the point though, so I guess I'll be redoing the list here to fix that mistake.

Skink Skirmishers cost more than rank and file Skinks. Extra per model for a shield and javelin. As that's how I have my Skinks modeled. And I love the Razordon,, but I don't know if I can't NOT use the gorgeous new stegadon model. lol

The Scar-Vet will keep the Burning Blade of Chotec as high AS is ramaprt in my play group. Since I have to do some retooling might as well put spears on all my Saurus units. As for Magic Defense, there is only 1 High Elf player that uses heavy Magic in my play group, and one Vampire player the raises Skeletons all the time, but killing Skeletons is fun and never gets old. lol Since I've learned a few things, i 'll remake my list tonight and post up the revised list. Thanks for the help.

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Last edited by squeek; 02-10-09 at 10:30 AM.
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-09-09, 11:50 PM
 
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Heh, have you thought about adding a Skink Chief with a Stegadon War-Spear onto your Stegadon? Little booger would cost an extra 105. Cut a skink outta the 25 man squad, and then you'd have a 3rd hero, and a much scarier Stegy.
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-10-09, 12:11 AM Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Blind Cougar View Post
Heh, have you thought about adding a Skink Chief with a Stegadon War-Spear onto your Stegadon? Little booger would cost an extra 105. Cut a skink outta the 25 man squad, and then you'd have a 3rd hero, and a much scarier Stegy.
The thought has actually crossed my mind as I'm sitting here at work thinking about how to change the list. lol
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-10-09, 03:05 AM
 
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Not too shabby having 3 S6 attacks, 4 S3 attacks, 4 S5 attacks, and 2d6+1 S5 Impact hits on the charge with a Terror causing behemoth. Makes me feel all tingly thinking about that connecting.
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