Ended WH40K Challenge Coins Kickstarter Project - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-19-13, 03:52 PM Thread Starter
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Default WH40K Challenge Coins Kickstarter Project

Here is the link:

Cancel (Canceled) by Joe Ward (deleted) ? Kickstarter

Last edited by imm0rtal reaper; 06-15-13 at 02:40 AM.
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-19-13, 04:04 PM
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I've never worked with a kickstarter project before. What are the benefits of pledging? Other than the coins being made period - to us, I mean.

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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-19-13, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by JAMOB View Post
I've never worked with a kickstarter project before. What are the benefits of pledging? Other than the coins being made period - to us, I mean.
look at the right hand side of his blog

depending on the amount of the pledge , you get X amount of these coins

Though TBH i cant see GW not stepping on this ( like there being a tenous
link their IP hasnt stopped them trying before )
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-19-13, 04:20 PM
So be it.
 
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Originally Posted by arlins View Post
look at the right hand side of his blog

depending on the amount of the pledge , you get X amount of these coins

Though TBH i cant see GW not stepping on this ( like there being a tenous
link their IP hasnt stopped them trying before )
Oh sweet didnt see that.

I'm really hoping they don't though, this seems like a cool idea. Best case scenario they let him get off his first batch, then after that I don't really care (though they might want to buy it off him).

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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-19-13, 04:26 PM
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He's been very carefull to not use official images and artwork but has used registered trademarks in his descriptives and even the title of this kickstarter. Heck if i created a project called "Nike shoe laces" you would expect Nike to slap it down faster than an uppety ice troll who just mouthed off to Thor.

The problem is that Warhammer 40k in the context of being a sci fi universe and games system is a trademark.

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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-19-13, 04:27 PM
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Moved to the appropriate Kickstarter sub-forum.

In more of an explanation as the OP didn't go into any detail:

Warhammer 40K Limited Edition Challenge Coins

This kickstarter has NO affiliation whatsoever with Games Workshop.

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Warhammer 40K Challenge Coins

Warhammer 40,000 is one of the most popular miniature games in the world. It is a space fantasy war game set in the forty-first millennium where mankind fights a brutal battle for survival against alien races and the forces of Chaos.

There are legions of devoted players who spends hundreds, if not thousands of hours, collecting and painting miniature figures and battling other players. To say that WH40K players are devoted, is a great understatement.

What is a Challenge Coin?

A picture is worth a thousand words...



These are challenge coins. They are custom designed solid brass coins which are larger and heavier than a silver dollar. They are 1.75 inches in diameter.

The tradition of challenge coins began with the military in World War 1. Since that time, almost every military unit in the world has their own coin. They have spread to police, fire, and schools. A challenge coin is a prized possession that is given to members of an organization for recognition, to enhance morale, and build camaraderie. Military units often get them after successful completion of a deployment. It is a source of pride.

There are many traditions around challenge coins. The basic idea is that you are supposed to carry it with you at all times in case you are challenged by a member of your organization to see if you have your coin. If you don't have your coin, you have to buy them a drink. If they challenge you and you meet their challenge by producing your coin, they have to buy you a drink.

How does Warhammer 40K fit in?

Challenge coins are perfect for the Warhammer universe. It is surprising that no one has ever made them before. The goal of my project is to create and manufacture seven Limited Edition challenge coins representing the most popular military units of the Imperium of Man. When you meet up with your fellow gamers, you will share the same bond that military, police, and fire personnel feel knowing that each of you has a challenge coin that represents the pride and camaraderie you feel!

Creating a coin is a unique art form. Each color in the design must be separated by metal ridges. The metal of the coin also comprises part of the design by having low and high spots. Below is the artwork for the Warhammer challenge coins I propose on creating. The artwork actually serves more like a blueprint for the creation of the coin. Each of these coins is plated in shiny silver metal.



Once again, the artwork is only a blueprint for the creation of the coin. As you can see in the photos that I provided of actual coins, the coins look amazing when in finished form.

If you are a Warhammer 40K fan, you obviously noticed that I did not copy the exact logos used in the game. There is a good reason for this. Namely, because I can't use any copyrighted images of Games Workshop. These coins are inspired by the official logos. Warhammer fans, please don't get offended! In military history, it is quite common that insignia and logos varies in design throughout the years. Considering the time span and the geographical distance in the Warhammer universe, this would be even more true. Also, in the true military tradition, challenge coins are usually designed by members of the unit and they often take quite a bit of liberty with their designs to personalize them for their unit.

What about using the names? I won't bore you with all the legal details, but I am familiar with copyright and trademark law. In simple terms, Games Workshop has trademarked the name Warhammer 40,000 and Space Marines in certain classes of "goods and services" related to miniature figures and computer games. Collectible coins is not one of the classes. In fact, if you look up Warhammer, a gun company and a fireworks company has the name trademarked in their respective classes. However, I don't intend to use Warhammer or Space Marines on the coins.

The other names such Dark Angels are not trademarked and due to their common nature would not even be allowed as trademarks.

However, I greatly respect Games Workshop and their trademark. I do not want anyone to be confused that the source of these coins is from Games Workshop. I have no association with them and as a fan, I only want to create some cool coins to enhance the Warhammer experience and possibly get new people involved in Warhammer! This is a fan created project.
While it's an interesting idea, I don't see this catching on, not to mention I'm pretty sure GW will crush his nuts for using the "official" terminology and whatnot, even if he has tried to cover his ass.


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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-19-13, 05:26 PM
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Nice idea.. but it defiantely won't catch on.... And challenge coins a military tradition? I've lots of friends in the military and have never heard of these before.

But yeah.. despite his attempt to cover his ass, GW legal are gonna rape him simply because he's promoting a 40k tie in product using official terms.
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-19-13, 07:17 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you Grimzag for the message you sent me.

On Games Workshop legal page, GW claims trademarks and copyrights for numerous terms. However, if you run a trademark search through the US Trademark Office and Great Britain trademark office, they have only registered a few of these terms.

So basically, they are claiming numerous trademarks that they have not registered. Common law does give you some rights if you have a trademark and not registered it.

However, the central issue in any trademark case, is the "consumer going to be confused by the source of the goods." You must have that for trademark infringement. This is a Kickstarter project created by a fan. It states that on my Kickstarter page. Any reasonable consumer would know that the source of these goods is not from Games Workshop.

Thank you very much for the thoughts. I know it is a tricky issue, but on the surface it really comes down to that.
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-19-13, 08:13 PM
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Sorry, but I predict that the moment GW legal sees this they will shit their crap and come down on it like a nuke from the sky. If we have seen anything over the past two years, then it is that GW legal are like pariahs in a lake, and will jump on the slightest scent of blood.

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Any reasonable consumer would know that the source of these goods is not from Games Workshop.
You seriously overestimate the intelligence of people on the internets...

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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-20-13, 04:54 AM
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I hate to say it, I really do, but this seems a little pointless to me. I mean having these coins, if they were official and came with a limited 40k starter set would be nice. But made by a 3rd party with poor quality images on the coins. I just can't see any reason to get them myself.

Add into that that he's specifically targeting a GW audience and has used the term "adeptus astartes" I won't be surprised if GW legal send him a nive friendly letter asking him very nicely to stop what he's doing and never do it again.

If nothing else though, it would be neat if coins like these ended up in other kickstarters as some KS only rewards for backing at certain levels (E.G pledge $100 and get this limited edition coin for the faction of your choosing, these will have a certificate with their number on them etc)

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