I added the bold of course.
and omitted this part, what i said later in reply:
i'll take you word on this, but i've never found it in my reading but it has been a while. i thought that the Numenoreans were rewarded with an island and extended life for their support in the wars of Beleriand.
and i always thought that Elendil was longed lived because he chose a mortal life, as opposed Earendil who chose an eternal life.
so bringing this up as your counter argument doesn't work; can't you tell that i'm questioning what i posted previously as wrong? i never discredited what you said, or even tried. 'i thought' does not equal 'it is'.
and if i posted some thing as fact in error, then just point that out. telling me my point of view fails on things i remember incorrectly (after i admit to remembering incorrectly) doesn't really help the discussion.
one of that says "in my opinion" and none of it says "it appears to be the case that". In other words, you're stating your opinion as fact, opinions for which you offer no evidence; you later admit you aren't comparing like with like, in that there are no similar events to compare, but you compare them anyway.
i understood the whole discussion the be a matter of opinions based on books that have been read, so i didn't think there was a need to post that.
Among the textual evidence I refer to is the statement that the breeding of Numenorians with the people of Rhovanion does not hasten the decline of Gondor[/quote]
i thought that we had gotten past this point...
Aragorn is described as being "more like to Elendil than any before him" in 'The Rings of Power and the Third Age', p 365 of The Silmarillion.
but how? does it tell us how he's more like Elendil? what if they have the same beard and eyes?
In other words, he dies on his 210th birthday
and thanks for clarifying this; no sarcasm meant. i wasn't sure on this at all.
Saying we don't see Aragorn do what Ar-Pharazon did is no argument. We don't see Ar-Pharazon walking, eating or drinking, unlike Aragorn. Are you telling me he couldn't do these things?
i don't know, are eating, walking, and drinking actions of might? you're trying to tell me that there is no weakening, but none of the characters do things that characters in the 1st/2nd Age do.
i'm trying to tell you that yeah, 3rd Age character might be that powerful, but don't come across that way.
feels like you're confused as to what i'm saying. the question raised (or so i thought) was that Mid-Earthers in the 3rd Age are weaker than Mid-Earthers in the 1st and 2nd Age. my point of view is 'they come across that way, but i'm not sure; i'm not sure what they're really capable of'.
You argue that Galadriel 'may have decided' to be weaker in the Third Age than she did in the First.
close. but i think we're defining power differently; yes, she's got one of the rings, and she's older than mountains, but she doesn't do much in the 3rd Age to help out the Fellowship. this relative disinterest to me makes her come across as weak.
she does give them gifts that are helpful in their cause, but she's not pro active beyond that.
and if i'm missing any thing else she does, just tell me.
she's an opponent of Sauron, but how? does she throw down with him or order minions to fight his minions?
I'm afraid that I just don't buy your argument that there's any personal weakening. There's no evidence for and a fair amount of evidence against.
i never said in absolute tems there was any personal weakness; never have.
to quote me (again):
also, i never even said the beings in the 3rd Age are proven to be 100% weaker than their predecessors. i said:
meaning that someone(s) who fights amies of dragons, Balrogs, and has the balls to fight a Vala comes across as more powerful than someone who fights a tribe of Orcs. yeah, the logic is skewed, but there it is, and that why (again, IMO) that 3rd Age Middle Earthers appear weaker.
and you keep quoting 'textural evidence' that doesn't prove your point of view. for one, i never doubted what you presented about the lineage of the Numenoreans.
for two, the only thing that you mentioned concerning the power of a 3rd Age denizen is Galadriel: ok, she's got a ring, she's old. but hardly did a thing (i'm sure you'll correct me if i'm wrong) in the 3rd Age to help in the War of the Ring. what about the average is he as powerful as one his Numenorean ancestors?
granted, Galadriel, Elrond, and others i'm sure had the potential to do great and powerful things in the 3rd Age, but we don't see them do it, so IMHO, that makes them seem weak.
good conversation Red Orc, stimulates the mind. and with no sarcasm meant, thanks for that.