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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-18-12, 06:09 PM Thread Starter
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Default Hardest army to play with in Warhammer

I'm thinking of getting back into Warhammer and outside of Ogres, Empire, Beastmen and Skaven (as the people I'd probably be playing already have or want those armies) I want to know, what's the hardest army to play with in Warhammer?

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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-18-12, 06:41 PM
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Probably Wood Elves as you have to be very tactically aware and every unit needs to work in synergy with each other to be really effective. Dark Elves also have a similar 'problem' but have more builds from the army book that are viable.
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-18-12, 07:28 PM
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Wood elves are fairly simple when you get used to the idea of working together and not being ablebto fight unsupported.

Dari Elves and High Elves are fairly similar in that aspect.

Weakest army? Tomb Kings, still.



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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-18-12, 08:14 PM
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None of the other 11 army books are easy to play. Maybe warriors of chaos is the most straightforward army because of its combat focus. Daemons of Chaos, if you play the right types of army builds, can be an easier army to learn to play while still have a good BS shooting unit (flamers), a great combat unit (bloodletters), a decent hard unit (plaguebearers), and some faster units (fiends and fleshhounds) and redirector/chaff/war machine hunting units (chaos furies). Dwarves can be simpler to play in that you sit back and let the enemy come to you and shoot them with war machines (organ guns, cannons and grudge throwers) and try to shut down their magic while you position you rank and file units to deal with the threats and match up with them as they come to you.

Wood Elves are reasonably competitive once you learn how to play them and adapt them to 8th edition, but a newer player will struggle with them.

Dark Elves have some tricky elements especially below 2400 points, but once one learns all the tricks and uses things like the pendant dreadlord and sac dagger lvl 4, it can be a reasonable army to play. Dark Elves have most of everything in a flying war machine hunting and redirector unit (harpies), a great core shooting unit (repeater crossbowmen), a great monster (hydra), one of the better 8th edition cav units (cold one knights), excellent character options (dreadlord, sorcoress, master and death hag with cauldron), and soem interesting elite infantry (blqack guard and witch elf horde). The issue is learning how to balance the mix for army comp and deal with threats because you are dealing with T3 rank and file models and only have the hydras to give you monsters, the 2+ armour saves of the cold one knights, and the pendant dreadlord to deal with certain high S/high T threats and combat units. Playing with two hydras makes dark elves relatively straight-forward to play.

Absent playing a broken Teclis build, High Elves are harder to play than people think because of the high cost per model and the army lacking the monsters that wood elves have with treemen and dark elves have with hydras. You have basically eagles and chariots (maybe also a cav unit) to act as redirectors and chaff and deal with the enemy army's redirectors and chaff units. I see some very experienced high elf players do well with them but, with Teclis and Book of Hoeth being banned in most tournaments and Teclis always banned in our area, even very experienced but more average high elf players are struggling to establish a winning record in five round tournaments.

Tomb Kings are also hard to learn to play and vulnerable to certain threats such that experienced TK players can do well but even experienced players are struggling to even win 50% of the time.

Some vampire counts builds can be pretty straightforward but others require a lot of finesse and understanding of the synergy of the units and magic casters is essential to make the army work.

Orcs and Goblins can be relatively straightforward with some builds but you have to deal with failed animosity tests and learn target priority with war machines (doom divers) and fast hitting models like snotling pump wagons, wolf chariots, boar chariots, and mangler squigs.

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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-18-12, 09:01 PM
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It strikes me that there is a world of difference between 'easy to play' and 'easy to play well'.

F'rex, Dwarves are damned easy to play. You take your favourite five War Machines, a Runlord and whatever Great-weapon big-block infantry floats your boat. You shoot for three turns then either win or lose depending on how much of the enemy reaches your lines. It's the easiest thign in the word and you'll win a lot of games.

I don't think that's playing the warhams very well, though. I don't think either you or the enemy will have much fun, as easy as it is for you.

On t'other hand, as hard as people recon it is to play Wood Elves, I've never had an un fun game against them, even when they've convincingly handed by my arse in gift wrap it's been a blast to play. And I think it's pretty easy to play Wood Elves in a fun way, even if you may not win as often.

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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-18-12, 09:24 PM
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Wood leves can be slightly hit and miss, depending on your foe. I played a guy who had a supped up Noble, who slaughtered my Knights, with about 9 attacks then his Spellweaver blew up, taking Wulfric and his marauders with her. Then he faced a gunline army and the same noble was blown of the table at turn 1. So yrs, hit and miss (With some builds).

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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-18-12, 10:20 PM Thread Starter
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I've been quite tempted by Wood Elves and I've actually got about eleven or so of the Glade Guard. To that end do people think it would be possible to convert the High Elves from the Island of Blood set?

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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-19-12, 01:19 AM
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Note remotely.

I mean, you could paint them green, but they would obviously be High Elves. Wearing armour and high helms, carrying the wrong weapons, being gryphons, you-name-it.

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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-19-12, 05:13 AM
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WE are a division of HE... so there's nothing really stopping you using some of the HE models as WE if the weapons and armour fits.

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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 07-19-12, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Sullen One View Post
I've been quite tempted by Wood Elves and I've actually got about eleven or so of the Glade Guard. To that end do people think it would be possible to convert the High Elves from the Island of Blood set?
I think with some convertion/sculpting skills this could work fairly well, the Sea Guard models fit the rules of the Eternal Guard you would need to remove the iconography on the shields and give them more of a woodland feel, hell even the armour could be painted to represent a scale armour formed of leaves.

Obviously the Griffon can be converted into a great eagle with some clipping, cutting and sculpting

The Reavers could make nice Glade Riders/Wild Riders, again with some minor conversions, also the Wild Riders would need more work then the Glade Riders

Not really sure on the Swordmasters, you might be able to convert them to wardancers but I think it'll be a fair bit of work.

Damn you Sullen one, I have a couple of sets knocking about and you made me want to do this now ( too many projects already)
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