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post #21 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 08:29 AM
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Update from the front, my DA detachment just annihlated a massive tyranid swarm along with numerous monsterous creaturs while only sustaining very light casualties. - true story DA stubborness lives up to it's reputation
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post #22 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 02:50 PM
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Spanner, I was actually planning on PM'ing you one of these days but I guess asking here would benefit the community more.

Ive been entertaining the idea of deathwing. An all terminator army would seem rather rewarding to win with....and Id like to have more experience in painting with all the colors involved. There seems to be a rather mindnumbingly endless debate on loadouts. The most common of sorts being x4 TH/SS (1 with CML), x1 SB/CF.

You seem to have a grasp on DA, what do you run? Do you magnetize and switch around? Since the FAQ, do shooty deathwing armies still have a place? Do you have to mix support units in, or are all terminator armies viable?

Anyone with experience or input feel free to contribute also, this isnt limited to spanner, and thanks for any replies
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post #23 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 03:39 PM
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I do like the survivability with having storm shield but against orks, guard, tyranids and some Eldar armies you're going to want some Lightning claw attacks as well to soften them up before they get to attack and have to try and save them all before the hammers attack. The CML is usually better than an assault cannon as it has twice the range and can use frag or krak missiles to take out vehicles or infantry equally well.

Best bet I think is to mix some squads up with a CML and some claws but have one that is fdesigned just to kill things in CC with Belial to really turn the pressure up.

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post #24 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 05:27 PM Thread Starter
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@Ravner298:
Deathwing I find tends to work well with a variety of squad loadouts. For pure DW, at at least 1500, you want about 2 or more 'generic assault' units, i.e. 4x TH/SS, CF/SB, CML. These guys bear the brunt of the fighting, using the chainfist for anti-tank, cyclone for anti-transport, and then the TH/SS make a mess of everything else.

Then you want at least 1 'shooty' unit. Despite the abundance of good armour, they still have a place in the army, as most of your army is CC orientated, so a squad like this makes all the difference against infantry armies. I tend to run as a basic squad with assault cannon, as the rending does stuff that CMLs can't, and maybe chuck in a chainfist as a safeguard. Taking a CML is a fair alternative though, as you also get the additional stormbolter - however I advise against taking a HF on any squad except one riding in a land raider as they simply won't get close enough to use it half the time, so is a waste of a heavy weapon.

Belial's squad needs to be a mix of both if there's no transport, but if you are taking one (which I advise), then go for a DLC and TH/SS split, but keep a chainfist handy for walker assaults. The apothecary is far more useful than the banner, but the latter is useful if you have the points. If taking both and dual HQ, then split the HQs and banner/apoth into two squads to provide a dual threat - as a secondary HQ I always go for Interrogator-chaplain as the buffs it provides are sweet, while the libby isn't worth the points, even for the unlimited psychic hood. However, if you're running in a transport or footslogging, don't be afraid to take a PA model, as their invun will be good enough against most attacks anyway.

With regards to the issue of splitting armament in squads into DLC vs. TH/SS, I always think DLC are pretty pointless unless used in a majority, as the output is about equivalent to TH/SS, but without the defensive capabilities. Therefore, I only go for a minimum of 4 DLC. The last model I give either TH/SS for defensive, or CF/AC for anti-tank. If you're mostly fighting infantry, however, it's possible to go max DLC, particularly if you have a ride.

Finally, with regards to deployment, I always find it better to have at least 1 land raider squad, and more so at 2000+. Land raider's are invaluable for providing protection and mobility to your otherwise slow and potentially vulnerable terminators. Although they can be one-shotted by melta, I find that you can always find solutions to that e.g. smoke or cover. I tend not to deep strike CC units unless in large quantities (3 or more), as otherwise scatter becomes an issue and they can be destroyed piecemeal. Even DWA doesn't provide a permanent solution to this, though it is helped by the use of RW teleporter homers. I don't mind deepstriking shooty units, though I often find it more valuable to walk them up, as they don't really be wanting to see CC.

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Spanner's got some great advice as well... Listen to that wise man.

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post #25 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 05:58 PM
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With regards to Deathwing, my preferred method is to specialise. Hence, I have one squad all armed with TH/SS (and one with a CML), one squad all armed with DLC (And a CML), then 2 squads loaded for shooting, one with a CML, the other with an assault cannon. Then depending on my opponent they change their deployment roles to suit.
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post #26 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 06:29 PM
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Don't underestimate lightning claws. 4 swings on the charge at I4 can make a significant difference when fighting opponents with access to power weapons and armor (marines), or large amount of attacks (orks).

I run a deathwing command squad with
2 TH/SS
1 APOTH w/ HF + CF
1 TLC w/ Company Banner
1 TLC or TH/SS Preference
Belial with LC's. (Don't waste that I!)

Basic DW loadout for me is
2 TH/SS
1 LC
1 CF/SB
1 LC or TH/SS depending on pref
w CML.

It allows for a benefit from would allocation as well as being right killy versus everything.


Shooty Squad is
1 TH/SS
2 PF/SB
1 CF/SB
1 PF/SB/CML

3++ for stray high AP shots, variety for wound alocation, CF for dealing with walkers and other nastiness. CML for popping everything. Plus 8 SB shots.

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post #27 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 06:32 PM
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Good info! How well does DW hold up against newer armies? If I recall, its a 4th edition dex with some modernizing in the FAQ. On paper, it seems like it'd have major problems against armies like DE and necrons...which is unfortunate because my buddy plays necrons and will be my common opponent. Should I stay away until they get a better book?
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post #28 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 06:39 PM Thread Starter
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Yes, against venomspam DE you will suffer due to the lack of mobility and the fact that most of your army is infantry. Tbh I have no idea about Newcrons as I haven't played against them, but if you reach combat, I believe Reanimation Protocols aren't an issue for weapons that ignore armour saves, so they're less of an issue. GK aren't too bad either as if you can take down their transports early with cyclones, then essentially you have the same range shooting as each other, except your termies are troops.

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Spanner's got some great advice as well... Listen to that wise man.

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post #29 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 06:54 PM
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Just curious, but, is there any point in running regular marines with a DW build?
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post #30 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-23-12, 07:15 PM Thread Starter
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What do you mean? If you mean power armoured troops alongside DW, I would say to an extent yes. Tri-wing is IMO the best way to play DA, using Deathwing, Ravenwing and 'greenwing' to each of their advantages. Essentially, the bests lists work at high levels, where you can fit Sammael and Belial in. You take two RW, two DW and two tacticals as troops, all with different roles. Then you fill the elites with two dreads and belial's DW squad, the fast attack with land speeder typhoons, and the heavy support with land raiders, preds, vindies etc.

The regular marines are there as support and to hold objectives, while the DW do all the dirty work.

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Spanner's got some great advice as well... Listen to that wise man.

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