Does anyone really 'love' 5th ed.? - Page 6 - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
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post #51 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-10-10, 02:04 PM
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I love 5th edition. I really really do.

Why? Because I absolutely HATED opponents consolidating from one combat to the next, having an entire game go by with many units doing nothing besides slowly walking forward, and above all, I HATED adding up the point totals at the end of each game. I lost at least one tournament to bad math (on my part).
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post #52 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-10-10, 02:26 PM
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Yes. It is, IMO, the best 40k has ever been. I dread the advent of 6e, in case they knee-jerk, and fuck it up.

Exceptions-
*Capture and Control. Like, really?
*The 'Most Important Rule' - NO. ALL the rules should be important, thanks.
*Victory Points. Just fuck off and die already. This isn't 2e.
*Not total clarity regarding what TLOS actually means. It says eyes, but it says 'don't worry about it' in the next line. Well, 'don't worry' isn't a rule, Alessio/Jervis - either they can pivot before declaring a target or not. I'd be okay with Infantry getting an actual 360 arc. Walkers, however, ...
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post #53 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-10-10, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by TheKingElessar View Post
...the best 40k has ever been.
Definitely second that; having played every edition, each edition - apart from 2nd Edition which lost too much of the fun of Rogue Trader for my taste - has fixed more problems than it made. I am even quietly positive that 6th Edition will be better still.

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ALL the rules should be important
For tournaments definitely; however, as a devotee of Storyteller games I secretly find the permission to ignore the rules if everyone will have more fun charming.

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*Victory Points. Just fuck off and die already. This isn't 2e.
I had forgotten VPs first surfaced in Second Edition; one more reason to not try it again to see if it was better than I remember.

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Not total clarity regarding what TLOS actually means. It says eyes, but it says 'don't worry about it' in the next line. Well, 'don't worry' isn't a rule, Alessio/Jervis - either they can pivot before declaring a target or not. I'd be okay with Infantry getting an actual 360 arc. Walkers, however, ...
As GW have apparently recruited a new proof-reader I hope the confusion of binding rules and helpful tips can be avoided.
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post #54 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-11-10, 12:31 PM
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In my opinion 5th ed. is absolutely fine,
I started playing in 4th ed. but only really got into the whole game when the csm codex came out

As me and my wargaming firends play 40k, not to absolutely thrash each other and gloat about it, but to have fun, that is what the game is for us - fun

if you don't like the rules because you feel when you play certain people the rules disadvantage you, then don't play those people

and one more thing, as much as the rules disadvantage you, they disadvnatage your oponent, TLOS for example, whilst he/she shoots up your unit where he can only see 1 model on one side of the board, you can do exactly the same thing back to him on the other side of the board, and if he's moved his models out of site so you can't, then he's just a darn good player isn't he?

so I am content with 5th ed. because I have fun with it, and so do my regular opponents, one of which play deamonhunters, using a mix of inqu. stormtroopers, grey knights and grey knight terminators, imperial guardsmen, not the most effective list, but using 5th ed he has fun with it

thats my opinion, and indeed everyone has their own

cheers

edd
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post #55 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-11-10, 04:29 PM Thread Starter
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To sum up then:
1. Most people don't love 5th ed. - so it is generally unloved.
2. Most people think it is fine in general but that it has some frustrating flaws and badly worded rules. A lack of clarity seems to be the source of most frustration.
3. Most people would be more likely to love it if all the codices were up-to-date with the current edition - thereby making 5th ed. more relevant and lovable regardless of which faction you prefer to play.
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post #56 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-11-10, 04:54 PM
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I wouldn't say that I love it but I am pretty fond of it. On the whole I think it's the best edition so far but still with room for improvement.
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post #57 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-12-10, 11:21 AM
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I think abomination is spot on here. 5th is by far the most balanced and thought out edition so far.

And yes there is still room for improvement. As I see it mostly in the TLoS department.
The general hate on the standart missions I don't understand though. The randomness of it insures that no specific type of list is the most dominant list. And if you dont like it you are free to make up your own missions in fact you are encouraged to do exacly that.

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post #58 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-12-10, 12:04 PM Thread Starter
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I think abomination is spot on here. 5th is by far the most balanced and thought out edition so far.

And yes there is still room for improvement. As I see it mostly in the TLoS department.
The general hate on the standart missions I don't understand though. The randomness of it insures that no specific type of list is the most dominant list. And if you dont like it you are free to make up your own missions in fact you are encouraged to do exacly that.
I would disagree with you on that - Annihilation lists will always be more dominant because they are geared towards high damage output. If you kill all the enemy troops then it reverts to kill/victory points. If you kill all your enemies then you win by default in ALL missions.
If you don't have all your stuff in transports then 5th ed. really fucks you, not just because of the BRB but because of the Imperium codices power-jump (way beyond power-creep).
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post #59 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-12-10, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by darklove View Post
I would disagree with you on that - Annihilation lists will always be more dominant because they are geared towards high damage output. If you kill all the enemy troops then it reverts to kill/victory points. If you kill all your enemies then you win by default in ALL missions.
If you don't have all your stuff in transports then 5th ed. really fucks you, not just because of the BRB but because of the Imperium codices power-jump (way beyond power-creep).
hehe and I would have to disagree here. Annihilation is the most difficult win condition in the game, even for a list geared towards this exact condition.

To be able to remove everything the oponent owns from the table requires not only a well above average list, but also alot of skill and generous amounts of luck with the dice.
If you have made such a list it will, in my experience, lack other very significant aspects, like troops to hold opjectives in case you fail to anihilate the enemy.

About transports. While extremly powerfull in the sense that it is extremly easy to play with and it gives your troops protection. You are in no way fucked if you don't have any. Less transports usually means you have more toys/boys to destroy your enemies' transports with.
Transports are also weak in killpoint missions as they are for the most part very easy to destroy.

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Last edited by Fenge; 07-12-10 at 02:33 PM.
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post #60 of 60 (permalink) Old 07-12-10, 02:01 PM
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I like 5th ed, its better then 4th... but the best edition I have played was 2nd. Sure it didnt work for quick games and was probably hell to try to get tournaments to work with it, but it included a full section of alies, had some awesome characters to give character to your army (yeah they were overpowered.. but so were everyone else's) and best of all a game was a serious matter- me and my friend agreed to meet up and play a 2500pt game... and that would be most of the day.

I also loved the lower model count in 2nd- less money for GW and therefore incredibly bad it did have the advantage that a mainline battletank was godly, terminators were kings of the battlefield and no unit was completely disposable. In 2nd you would see a carnifex coming at you and wet yourself... now to get the same impact you need a super-heavy and yet still most armies would have enough firepower to take it down quickly.


As for anhiliation- I used to play for it all the time with my nids. I set the army up for objectives and had huge numbers of KP (not to mention I used biovores throughout the last codex) so I was almost always going to be behind on KP games. This gave me a rather unique approch to anhiliation games: if I didnt win by anhiliation I was almost certain to lose.
I managed to wipe most people off the board quite quickly (loved my old nuke choir) unless they were fully mech. When I didnt wipe the enemy out it was quite often the case that I hit them so hard early on that in the endgame they just couldnt pick up KP: the game might be 7:3 in their favour after turn 3 with them only having a total of 10KP in the game... but if they have nothing left to really deal damage then I'm in a very strong position (I never went after killing whole units early with my nids- just bits of everything and trasnports, everything else could wait).

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