Red Orc got this right spot on. Its because the Ultras are seen as THE space marines and that they get all the new releases/rules. When in fact they just happen to be another Chapter in amongst thousands of others. The use of the Ultra Chapter by GW on the product packaging is to help us identify product instore when buying. Im sure this must happen with other armies ie all eldar same, Orks all same etc. On top of that GW does appear to use the Ultras in a lot of other material from tutorials to cover art etc. All these other images just go to enforce our perception that Ultras are THE space marines. So in my opinion its over exposure to the Ultras as to why folk dont entirely like them.

As others have stated, I mostly dislike the Ultramarines because they are the main GW army, 'daddys boys' as it were. Add to that, the fact that they are such goody goody rule followers. They the norm, the baseline. Ultramarines are the unadorned plain vanilla sundae of the WH40K world, and frankly I like sprinkles.

Sometimes it just feels like they are the army that involves no creativity. (I know thats not strictly true, but it has that feeling sometime) They are sort of spoon fed army, in that GW builds and disseminates the fluff for them, and people just "blindly obey"

I do, however, quite like the paint scheme of the army.

But in the end, I dont think people really hate the Smurfs, its more that they are the GW mould army, used to illustrate points, and really the fun is in taking the foundation and building your own unique army on top of that.


ps. Im not intending to trod on UM players toes, the above are just my personal feelings.

Red Orc, bang-on target, as usual.

My personal contempt (if I were to use such a strong word for it) really isn't the UM's, but in "Codex Chapters" in general. As I've stated before, Chaos got stripped of it's options and general, "fluffiness," for the sake of streamlining, and streamlining was the *supposed* way of 5th ed codecis, then I took a look at the new "Codex: Fanboy" and about sold my stuff on e-bay. Since, a more even-tempered approach has been adapted, and I'm okay now.

For you folks who've played codex chapters for a while, I have respect for you, as I do for anyone who's been playing for a while, and I can appreciate where you're at when it comes to having a new codex thrown your way, it's a good feeling, there's no denying. I remember feeling the same way when the 4th ed Chaos 'dex came out (anyone else remember the abortion from 3rd ed known as, "Pamphlet: Chaos?").

The reason I jokingly (mind my humor, it's a tad dark, and a bit cynical--if you can't laugh at yourself and all that, right?) refer to the new marine codex as "Codex: Fanboy" is due to the insane amount of new folks getting into them (as with any comparison I make, according to my own demigraphic), not for the models (hell, one kid I know who got into vanilla marines hates the models), but for the power of the dex, and the power alone. One of my friends got into marines, after playing chaos for years, as he says, "I feel it's the only way I can keep up, anymore." Another guy (and an idea I've even given some consideration to) is using his chaos marines with the new marine dex as a "counts as" renegade army.

So, (for those of you who skipped my "Block O'Text" to the conclusion) I feel it isn't the UM's specifically. It's codex marines in general. Not because of any one reason, but for a few. Probably the biggest being balance and attention. I don't think the ridiculous amount of time between one codex release and the next is due to time taken to write the thing as much as it is to coincide with new model releases, which makes a certain amount of sense. But, to those who don't play codex marines, it's a kick in the teeth, seeing as we still have 3rd edition codecis floating around.

Speaking of, I have much respect for you DE and Nec players out there. Sticking with your armies, even though you've been given no love for two editions now.

Balance in all things...

It's a bad emotion call Jealousy

Jealousy? I'd say it's more a healthy dose of contempt.

I don;t much care for them, but then again, I don;t run ANY of the "official" chapters.

The fun of building an army, for me, is in making your own.

All I really have against the Smurfs is Calgar... I actually use a proxied Sicarius to get back some of the stuff I lost with Traits.

maybe cuz it's funny to hate the most popular chapter. and wouldn't it be annoying to always play against ultramarines? i've played ten times against ultramarines at my gw. of course, i shouldn't be talking, i have 5,000 points of ultramarines!!

Ultramarines are like the obnoxious "I'm so smart" kid at school who is always sucking up to the teacher. (GW)

I remember hearing something about those 'pointy-eared bastards.'

An element of rivalry in competition can help a lot, as long as it's friendly. Some armies are tactical opposites (BA and Tau) while some are trying to out do each other (BT and Orks). The UM are just plastered everywhere by GW and they can easily attract hatred if you haven't played against them. A well played army can engender hatred, or an "overpowered" army. Anyway, having someone to rag on can be a lot of fun if it's all in good fun.

I hate Ultramarines because they are like the Dallas Cowboys of Space Marines. They always win, GW pushes them like crack-cocaine and they are the Uber-Boyscouts of the 41st millenium. I mean really, the codex makes it sound like Ultras are the only real Space Marines since their Primarch wrote the Codex Astartes and they are the progenetors of more than half the chapters currently active. Basically, I hate them because GW wants everyone to love them. I am an underdog kinda guy.