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post #81 of 185 (permalink) Old 02-28-15, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jin View Post
still, that is warhammer.
not GW.
But that's the thing isn't it. Warhammer is GW.

For Warhammer to exist it requires Games Workshop.

Now if you ignore the product that the create all you are left with is a Small Corporation.. Just read the first line of their Business model "We make things. We are a manufacturer. Not a retailer"..

And that's the point, When you think that the games themselves are somehow Free without the intervention of GW, you will grow to hate GW. But its not We support GW in producing this stuff with what we buy, and how we spend our money has an impact on how the game changes.

So sit back enjoy the ride and be happy in what we have because we have a hobbie that's played the world over.. all because of a small building in the east-midlands of Great Britain.

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post #82 of 185 (permalink) Old 02-28-15, 02:02 PM
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I think the return of Throne of Skulls and Battle Brothers is a good step in the right direction; whether it had always been planned to make a comeback or whether it's a spontaneous thing now that WHW is improved, I don't know, but recognizing a desire for competitive 40k is great. 7th edition has supported that, I think; while some books (hai GK) have lost a lot from their 5th edition incarnations, it's not that significant and I feel that the 7th edition books are much closer in relative 'power levels' to each other than books in 5th or more especially, 6th.

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post #83 of 185 (permalink) Old 03-01-15, 12:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uveron View Post
But that's the thing isn't it. Warhammer is GW.

For Warhammer to exist it requires Games Workshop.

Now if you ignore the product that the create all you are left with is a Small Corporation.. Just read the first line of their Business model "We make things. We are a manufacturer. Not a retailer"..

And that's the point, When you think that the games themselves are somehow Free without the intervention of GW, you will grow to hate GW. But its not We support GW in producing this stuff with what we buy, and how we spend our money has an impact on how the game changes.

So sit back enjoy the ride and be happy in what we have because we have a hobbie that's played the world over.. all because of a small building in the east-midlands of Great Britain.
This is shyte.
There is no "small building in the east-midlands of Great Britain" that "makes things",
any more than there is paper money who buys a house.

Warhammer is a cooperative endeavor through which human beings voluntarily shape their lives,
develop skills, grow and learn and care for one another.
GW is - currently - a group of money-junkies who hawk prefab-CAD plastic through a marketing framework called a rules-system.

The difference between the money-junkies who run GW now,
and the partying metal head-set who put the who thing together,
is the difference between destruction and creation.

The business environment within the latter-day corporate financial neo-fascism
that pervades our days as contemporary Western culture
encourages monetary success while creating nothing,
and GWs managers seem to act under this spell.
They take "Warhammer" as a commodity,
to be pumped up and maxed out but eventually burnt down if it means more money for investors.
Max-minning the gains over an investor's period of interest means
- in the previous decade -
spectacular performance for capital
and immediate capital kickbacks for management
at the expense of the market, community or commodity in question.
Fracking is a good example here - common corruption.
Everyone (who doesn't live near a fracking well) gains.
GMO crops are another (better) example.

Today's GW saw Warhammer as this grassy hillock,
and went all factory farm monocultural Monsanto with the purging and the imbalance
trying to maximize their own returns
but limited by their tiny brains.

Imagine the morning-after a GW COO's wet dream
- and we all see it coming - Titans in the clearance bin at Walmart.
That means peak saturation and volume and a crash into ...
other media, other stuff - space marine lunchboxes and yada.

The game, Warhammer, the community - all of this has nothing to do with GW.
Not these people, not in my opinion, and not anymore.
It is our hill.

At least, that is how things seem to me at the moment.
I hope that someone will tell me that I am wrong...

Last edited by jin; 03-01-15 at 12:41 AM.
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post #84 of 185 (permalink) Old 03-01-15, 12:38 AM
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I think that's a fair point, @jin . I didn't really think about it that way before, in terms of the community and experience between players being what makes the game so awesome. Of course it is obvious, but I don't really step back away from the hobby to analyze it so much as just dive in and experience it.


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post #85 of 185 (permalink) Old 03-01-15, 12:40 AM
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I do believe that the hobby and the corp that facilitates it are very separate, but without GW, warhammer goes unsupported, and we know how that ends up.
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post #86 of 185 (permalink) Old 03-01-15, 12:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Einherjar667 View Post
I do believe that the hobby and the corp that facilitates it are very separate, but without GW, warhammer goes unsupported, and we know how that ends up.
Kickstarter gamers-union worker-owned cooperative with on-site 3d printing and narrative driven content sensitive to current events interpreted through the future mythology of unending conflict. Guest judges, better ideas and engineering... ends up like that.

Chopped 40k?
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post #87 of 185 (permalink) Old 03-01-15, 12:50 AM
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More likely the IP would end up twisted and snagged in legal limbo for eternity as lawyers bicker and drag their feet and so on and so on. Legally, no one could touch warhammer as it would never EVER end up in Public Domain.
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post #88 of 185 (permalink) Old 03-01-15, 01:11 AM
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While I'm not necessarily endorsing @jin 's rise of the gamer proletariat, I wanted to point out that at least in the USA this isn't true.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Einherjar667 View Post
Legally, no one could touch warhammer as it would never EVER end up in Public Domain.
All IP, copyright, and patent eventually pass into the public domain (in the USA and most countries it takes about 70 years, but it can take up to 150 or so in others). The earliest incarnation of Mickey mouse for example is in the public domain now. It might take 100 years but eventually the Warhammer universe would be public property.

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post #89 of 185 (permalink) Old 03-01-15, 01:13 AM
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Ok, so when we're 200 years old... Nevermind. Ugh.
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post #90 of 185 (permalink) Old 03-01-15, 02:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jin View Post
Kickstarter gamers-union worker-owned cooperative with on-site 3d printing and narrative driven content sensitive to current events interpreted through the future mythology of unending conflict. Guest judges, better ideas and engineering... ends up like that.

Chopped 40k?
No what would happen is we would have 100 small copy-cat games without the 'global support' it would break down and slowly the hobby would die.


Anyway, not going to argue about it. I have said my peace.

Quote:
GW is not Finally Getting it Right. Because the have been doing it Right since the 1980's.. My life is a happy place because of the product they sell.

Why they are doing it is another debate. And one I dont care to have.

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