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post #51 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-06-14, 08:03 AM
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Better =/= right.

It is a step in the right direction, but they are alienating a good half, if not more of their fanbase. Good rules sell models - as evidenced by tau/dar cropping up everywhere shortly after. And newcrons, And grey knights in 5th. Vampire Counts, Skaven, Ogres, 7th edition high elves.

They were labled broken in some aspects due to unforeseen combinations - a lack of stress testing as it were. By catering to that aspect, people might start fielding things like meganobz, assault squads, berserkers, blodthirsters etc again.

They are learning, such as now allowing 50% lords in fantasy to let you play low level monster mash lists.



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post #52 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-06-14, 10:01 AM
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It would be nice if they released a test army of the rules before they went to print, so people of the WAAC mentality could see how easy they are to break or abuse.
of course they wont because then some people might not buy the books when they do come out, but then again they claim something like 60-70% of people illegally download their stuff anyway.
Personally with most of the books i tend to look at them in store or find someone with a copy and have a gander at it. If i like it i will buy it. If not then i will just try to remember the basics or jot down a few things on scraps of paper to give me a general idea of what the rules for particularly interedting units are.
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post #53 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-09-14, 03:35 PM
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My issue with GW is that they dont do much to garner custom loyalty. No reward cards, no sales, no seasonal discounts, nothing. They are a premium product that by definition excludes a large number of people and they rely solely on the natural instincts of their customer base be it a desire to collect, or to win battles by having the best units. It wouldn't hurt them to demonstrate a bit of reciprocation.

That aside, I have been involved mainly in fantasy but in general with their products for over 15 years and the models and rules have improved dramatically.

As for the price point, there are a ton of online sellers that undercut GW so there is really no reason to go into a store and buy any of their models at their face value. Their are alternative companies that make hobby stuff like tools and paints that are much more competitively priced.

It still doesn't excuse the cost of building an army, especially when a large section of their customers are children.
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post #54 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-10-14, 07:30 AM Thread Starter
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GW have done loyalty cards before and recently offered a free product and a loyalty based offer for those using the online store when they revamped it and arguably they are directly discounting more products with the current trend of packaged together kits which offer serious savings, but the question wasn't about price, the reality of price is simple, unless you give something away for free you will always exclude a portion of the population, GW can only ever set it's prices at the level that will sustain the company,its not GWS place to make it more affordable it's up to the individual customer to choose to buy or not based on whether they feel it's value for money or not, you can have loads of money and feel GW is a rip off or you can have very little cash and still feel like GW should charge more or anything in between,ultimately if you want to play the games and own the minis you will find a way.



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post #55 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-10-14, 08:03 AM
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Originally Posted by bitsandkits View Post
...GW can only ever set it's prices at the level that will sustain the company,its not GWS place to make it more affordable it's up to the individual customer to choose...ultimately if you want to play the games and own the minis you will find a way.
Completely agree with you B&K.

Unfortunately I think we can all agree on that there a lot of illegally downloaded codexs most of which are a condensed format only containing the army choices and upgrades. I think GW can still reduce the amount of pirating from people if they had different options for the books for the game.

I mean GW already makes the small A5 (or so) size books for Dark Vengeance, I cannot see a reason why they do not release that for $30 USD or whatever is roughly half of the hardback rules that they just released maybe a week or two ago?

I can see GW doing the same thing with codexs honestly, having a super cheap codex that can get used and abused during travel and not feel as badly than if one beat the crap out of their hardback codex. (I would be furious)

Especially now with the newer battle forces that are roughly $160+ USD to come with a little codex would be a great incentive to buy them.

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post #56 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-10-14, 10:00 AM
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I know it isn't a great solution. But tbh i still think that the hardback copies if bought from GW directly should come with access to a digi copy tied to the persons account.
Personally i have hardback / paper copies of the books i use. But i also have digi copies of the ones i need so dont have to carry 10kg of rule book, 2-3 codex, 1-2 imp armour and all that with me when i go to play someone.
30k is really the killer with that with the 3 heavy books and now 2 redbooks. Having them in digi would be great to have for the saving of my poor back, as well as the risk of if you get mugged the 3 books to replace would be £200.
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post #57 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-10-14, 11:10 PM Thread Starter
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I agree there are alot of illegal down loading of codex, but I don't think reducing the price would make one bit of difference to the overall sales figures, most people who down load like that, are not going to suddenly stop and buy a codex because it has become cheaper,if GW halved the price of the codex books tomorrow the most likely scenario would be that the bloke who was gonna spend £30 on a book will just buy two and the bloke who was gonna down load it does so anyway and feels less remorse because the products perceived value is now half of what it was, people justify essentially criminal activity such as buying counterfeit models from China because they consider GW prices as too high, if that's the bench mark to break the law then realistically GW can't possibly consider reducing the price in the hope people will buy more.



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post #58 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-11-14, 10:34 AM
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I am unsure with the price vs pirate thing.
I actually think if the price was lower they would sell more, however as you said it would probably be people buying more books so maybe getting themselves army books for armies they dont own.
However i do think that some who steal the books would spend a small amount on the codex as it would be less of an army tax to buy it.
I did segest before some time ago that a loyalty system could work for digi copies of things. This would mean that if you got your digi copy of an army book for instance, when they then bring out the updated new edition of the book (so 8th edition or whatever) you should not have to pay as much as the likely chance is that 40% of the book is copy pasted from the previous one with the pictures, timeline, lore, descriptions.
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post #59 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-11-14, 12:28 PM
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From my own point of view I see no justification in buying pirated books or counterfeit models. Primarily its theft, but it also reduces profits for GW and in doing this could eventually lead to them going bust and the end of the game as we know it (far fetched but not unfeasible).

I get the impression from the thread that GW is hated for charging a similar price to other companies for their products. I don't count things like Bolt action as the mini's are just not the same quality. Digital codexes do seem a bit highly priced, but that's the same as e books all round. There is very rarely a significant drop from a hardback to a digital format book relating to price. A codex is still about the same price as an elite unit so not that great an expenses when it comes to an armys cost. Its still less than a PS4 or Xbox 1 game which will generally only be used for 12 months before the sequel replaces it.

As much as I hear on the web that people are leaving in droves, my gaming circle is very active and has not diminished that much, and the tournament scene in the South of the UK is still very active.

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post #60 of 185 (permalink) Old 11-11-14, 03:53 PM
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Dont get me started on xbox or ps4 games though (dating back many years of consoles). I still think console owners get ripped off for games. When you have to pay £50 for a game that 1 month later is on PC is £35 and then will likely go on sale on steam for 50% off. Then console players are getting it rough. Espesially as they are using a machine that is equal to an average gaming PC that is 4 years old.
The sad thing comes with the PC ports of console games that are deliberately left with crummy framerates and graphics, so the PC players dont get a better quality game (though assassins creed on ps4 is getting the sxrew job cos it cant be made to be better than the xbox version or xbox ppls will cry).

I think that is enough ranting about computer games from me...

I do agree though that model wise you often get what you pay for. Back in my day when i first started i could buy a pack of about 30 skeletons or 20 space marines or whatever and probably have only spent £10. I know in those 30 years there has been inflation and all that. However compare those models to the ones you get today when you get 10 models for £25. Though the quality of the old beaky mk6 ones was great at the time i am sure that a 3d printer could knock them out today at the same level of detail. But the current models are great (when they arent malformed or arrive in need of repair) and very few models from other companies come close.
That being sad i do like some of the old models more than the new ones. The 90s (i think) Daemonettes are so much better than the newer ones.
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