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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 07:11 PM Thread Starter
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Default Coming back after 10+ years, returning to Chaos but which?

I last played in the days of 3rd edition and am recently looking at getting back into the game since I have a game store close by where 40k is played often. In 2nd and 3rd I played Chaos and I'm looking at starting a new Chaos army (I don't have any of my old stuff). I have the Codex and the Chaos models from Dark Vengeance and am currently thinking of what I want out of the army to start looking at additional purchases. I'm by no means a super-competitive player and the local meta is more fluffy/friendly than competitive, but I also don't want to lose all the time.

I've narrowed it down to two choices, the first being a fairly fluffy Crimson Slaughter army and the second being a Nurgle-themed (but not Plague Marines, see below) army representing the Grey Death renegade chapter mentioned in a paragraph in the Chaos Codex from the Abyssal Crusade.

I've been reading the Crimson Slaughter fluff (Dark Vengeance, Crimson Dawn and the new supplement) and their backstory really appeals to me, however I'm not a fan of Possessed and if I did a Crimson Slaughter army I'd like it to be kept true to the backstory so I'd be looking at an undivided force of Marines, likely with Cultists, and backed up by daemon engines and vehicles; my idea would be to have a force that looks very much like a regular Space Marine army (as they are a newer renegade chapter) but then have the daemon engines to show that it's clearly corrupted. Also the Forgefiend/Maulerfiend are some of my favorite models based on looks alone :D

The second idea is as said before the Grey Death, which is a Nurgle-aligned warband mentioned in a paragraph about the Abyssal Crusade. This would basically be a clean slate as other than the name of the warband and the fact they used to be the Iron Drakes Space Marines, and that they surrendered to Nurgle on the world of Anathrax after half of them were infected by some spores and mutated into giant fungus things, there is nothing about these guys so I could do whatever I want. I know that Mark of Nurgle is very powerful but I would likely make the core of my army MoN Chaos Marines as opposed to Plague Marines as it's always seemed to me like Plague Marines (as in the actual unit) were mostly Death Guard (although I might field some), and this army would give me a good opportunity to field a Daemon Prince (whereas one really doesn't fit in with the Crimson Slaughter army), another model I really like the looks of. However this concept doesn't seem to lend itself to being a fully fledged army but rather a warband roaming around somewhere, and there's also the fact that nothing is written so I'd have to come up with my own color scheme, characters etc. (which can be both good and bad)

So I am torn between something that has "supported" rules and where I like the fluff, with something that gives me more or less free reign to build what I want and come up with my own background. Tactics-wise it seems that regular Chaos Marines are pretty lackluster but I'm not sure if giving them Mark of Nurgle is worth doing either, so the dilemma is which would be more effective but at the same time I also want to have a solid, fluffy army on the field no matter which one I pick, but I think either will give me that option.
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 07:27 PM
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Crimson Slaughter doesn't really not fit with the Daemon Prince leading it, mainly due to the fact that if they have loads of possessed, this is just the apex of where possession gets you.
I have ran with a Deathguard army for ages and in general not used Plague Marines as I liked the CSM and Chosen with MoN. I think Plague Marines aren't just the Deathguard, they are kinda the Elites of the Deathguard though. I would concede that the majority still around from Horus Heresy would probably be Plague Marines or above by now. But Deathguard do get new members joining them.
Taking Typhus for the Plague Zombies is a great thing though, though TBH I find him a bit of a waste .
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 07:29 PM Thread Starter
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Yeah I'd 99% avoid going Typhus "Walking Dead" spam because not only is it cheesy to me but it doesn't appeal to me at all.
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 07:48 PM
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Crimson Slaughter doesn't work with a Daemon Prince because he has no fun toys to wield (they are a fairly young renegade chapter too). Plus their "Possessed" are possessed by the spirits that haunt them, not Daemons.

Grey Death could play well using the main codex alone (DP of Nurgle with the Black Mace Smashing things helps too, he's "blessing" things with disease!) as Plague Marines are a solid core choice is you want to field them. Just bring a Lord with a MoN and they're troops!
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 07:57 PM Thread Starter
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Crimson Slaughter doesn't work with a Daemon Prince because he has no fun toys to wield (they are a fairly young renegade chapter too). Plus their "Possessed" are possessed by the spirits that haunt them, not Daemons.

Grey Death could play well using the main codex alone (DP of Nurgle with the Black Mace Smashing things helps too, he's "blessing" things with disease!) as Plague Marines are a solid core choice is you want to field them. Just bring a Lord with a MoN and they're troops!
Yep, and that's what has me torn. On one hand I like the Crimson Slaughter fluff a LOT (probably one of the best fluff pieces I've read), but I know that I'm going to want a likely subpar (but still decent?) army to reflect a fluffy army versus cheese or spam. On the other hand though Grey Death would let me mold the army how I choose, without feeling like I'm ignoring any fluff. The other downside though is I'm not a big converter, and Nurgle armies especially tend to lend themselves towards conversions.

From what I've seen of my local meta it's not very cutthroat, there's one "powergamer" with Tau+Eldar, but everyone else tends to prefer less uber-competitive armies.
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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 08:07 PM
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For CS I'm running a MoK heavy army (troops are CSM squads 10 deep, with 2 meltas, everyone getting CCWs extra, MoK, Icon of Wrath and the champ has a pair of lighting claws all in a Rhino) so I can have a decent core designed to be as savage as their fluff suggests. Plus lightning claws look cool.

As for the Nurgle stuff, you could just field regular CSM with their paint scheme. That's what the Cleaved basically are.
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 08:12 PM Thread Starter
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For CS I'm running a MoK heavy army (troops are CSM squads 10 deep, with 2 meltas, everyone getting CCWs extra, MoK, Icon of Wrath and the champ has a pair of lighting claws all in a Rhino) so I can have a decent core designed to be as savage as their fluff suggests. Plus lightning claws look cool.

As for the Nurgle stuff, you could just field regular CSM with their paint scheme. That's what the Cleaved basically are.
That's true, my idea for Grey Death would be to field regular CSM with MoN as an alternative to Plague Marines, mostly because I think that would fit better overall than going the normal "plague marine spam" route like everybody else does. I would want to certainly avoid the typical Nurgle army spam, which is why I'm not 100% sold on the Grey Death as that's ultimately what it might end up being, and then it wouldn't matter what they were painted or called if it was the same Nurgle Biker Lord, Nurgle Oblits, Plague Marines, Heldrake nonsense like every other "competitive" Chaos Nurgle list.
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 08:21 PM
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Yeah, if you're not looking at running the Plague Marine swarm then MoN on regular troops isn't a bad way to go. It won't be -as- powerful, but it won't be horrible either.
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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 08:22 PM Thread Starter
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Yeah, if you're not looking at running the Plague Marine swarm then MoN on regular troops isn't a bad way to go. It won't be -as- powerful, but it won't be horrible either.
That's good to know since I had read that Marks on regular guys generally isn't worth taking. Of course that doesn't really help with narrowing down the choice ;) but getting more information to make an informed decision always helps.
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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 03-25-14, 08:28 PM
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That's good to know since I had read that Marks on regular guys generally isn't worth taking. Of course that doesn't really help with narrowing down the choice ;) but getting more information to make an informed decision always helps.
They're only completely useless if you accept the idea that Plague Marines are the only troop choice in the codex. The other options may not be quite as effective but it doesn't mean they are completely useless.
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