You hate named/special characters? - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
General 40k This is the place to talk about everything related to Warhammer 40k.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 05:39 PM Thread Starter
JUGGERNUT
 
venomlust's Avatar
venomlust's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,558
Reputation: 32
Default You hate named/special characters?

I've seen this pop up on forums and in person. There are players who hate when their opponents field special/named characters.

One of them was pissed at me because Kharn raped his entire squad of Death Company. Quite naturally, Kharn is now overpowered in his mind. After losing the game to me, part of the excuse was that he didn't bring any named characters.

Most named characters are definitely not overpowered... quite a few aren't worth their points cost.

Is it the perceived lack of originality? Is it that you think they're blatantly overpowered?

Just curious, I love the discussions we have on this forum so I just wanted to start another. I personally don't care either way; I'd just like to hear what you all have to say on this subject.



SUFFER NOT THE PONY TO LIVE.

- - AMATEUR KHORNESTAR: MY BLOG THING - -

Last edited by venomlust; 02-03-14 at 05:41 PM.
venomlust is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 06:24 PM
Senior Member
 
Moriouce's Avatar
Moriouce's Flag is: Sweden
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Borås
Posts: 2,195
Reputation: 63
Default

I love them! It is just to bad so few are worth taking. I play harder when bringing one and it makes it more fun trying to kill that special character. It is a win all in its own.

Your friend sound like a bad looser and Kharn was there to take the heat.

I just wish that all named characters where balanced so that you saw more of them.

Good to be green

Barks Dakka Ladz: W3-D2-L3
Altansar Eldar: W3-D0-L2

Moriouce is offline  
post #3 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 06:32 PM
Senior Member
 
iamtheeviltwin's Avatar
iamtheeviltwin's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Beyond the Pale
Posts: 992
Reputation: 32
Default

Speaking as an old player who has had to adjust to 6ed I can give you the reasons that I tend to avoid named characters.

The first is that when I played (2ed/3ed) you had to have "permission" to play special characters, so I got used to never playing with them. It is just a matter of personal preference. I have found this opinion fading though as I have become more embroiled in the current game.

The second is a matter of personal playstyle. If you look at my armies I try to build around my own themes and style of play. I find few special characters fit my wants in combination of wargear, powers, and play. There are a few I do use, Maugan Ra and Khorso Khan, but both fit into the armies that I play them with. As good as Asurman or Vulkan might be they aren't in the style of my army.

Finally, it can be a matter of the fluff. Some people take the game very seriously in a narrative style and if Kharn is running around in every small skirmish they play it could be hard to fit him into the mental picture. Even though I run Khan, I run him as a proxy for the Master of the Hunt in my own marine chapter...not as Khan. I also tend to avoid running named characters in small games (for fluff reasons as much as points).

Now my opinion on the matter has changed and softened as I play more 6ed and really I have no problem now if my opponent wants to run Special Characters...even if I am hesitant to run them myself.


As for your opponent, that sounds like sour grapes. Although the load-outs may not always be ideal most named characters are more powerful than a normal character of the same point cost via whatever special rules or unique wargear they posses. This means you have to treat them differently...It can sometimes come as a surprise to an unprepared opponent when the special character performs above and beyond what they expect from that type of character (i.e. "what do you mean Magnus is better than a regular Chapter Master")

Servants of the Laughing God (Harlequin Themed Eldar Army)
First Eastern Mirage Corps (C:SM)
I am the Evil Project Log (All my work since restarting the hobby)
The Crusade of Morr (WFB Empire Battle Reports)
Dem Bones (Dice Rolling Program)
iamtheeviltwin is offline  
 
post #4 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 06:35 PM
Rattlehead
 
MidnightSun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: New Sheoth
Posts: 6,741
Reputation: 83
Default

They used to be opponent's-permission-only, but that changed in 5th edition where Special Characters became a more fundamental part of the game.

Often, you can make a nastier character from the basic HQs. Kharn is not *that* much better than a Lord with Axe of Blind Fury and maybe a Juggernaught.

But I can count the really strong special characters on my extremities and have some spare. Most of them are good at best, more often underwhelming or downright bad.

Creator of Utilitarian Ultramarines Memes - join the XIII on Facebook (no XVII allowed).
MidnightSun is offline  
post #5 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 06:42 PM Thread Starter
JUGGERNUT
 
venomlust's Avatar
venomlust's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,558
Reputation: 32
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MidnightSun View Post
Kharn is not *that* much better than a Lord with Axe of Blind Fury and maybe a Juggernaught.
Sometimes I have both in my army. Those always make for very fun games. In the game described in my OP, Kharn turned into a Spawn after annihilating my opponent's Reclusiarch. That was a hilarious outcome which I'll never forget.

I didn't know about the "permission for named characters" rule of old. Makes sense that veteran players have that lingering feeling about them.


SUFFER NOT THE PONY TO LIVE.

- - AMATEUR KHORNESTAR: MY BLOG THING - -

Last edited by venomlust; 02-03-14 at 06:45 PM.
venomlust is offline  
post #6 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 06:44 PM
Senior Member
 
Sethis's Avatar
Sethis's Flag is: United Kingdom
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Alston, Cumbria
Posts: 4,190
Reputation: 58
Default

The only special character that is/was even vaguely powerful is/was Mephiston, and even he had answers such as Plasma.

Anyone who pisses and moans about SCs in this edition of the game is either nursing a holdover from about a decade ago (when they were actually unreasonably overpowered) or has no idea how to actually play the game.

90% of people think they are above average.

Statistically Improbable. Psychologically Inevitable.
Sethis is offline  
post #7 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 07:21 PM
Senior Member
 
Stormxlr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 443
Reputation: 7
Default

If it exists you can use it ,thats my logic. Who the hell are you to tell me that I can't use the model i bought, built and painted... unless you are my girlfriend.

If you remove special characters from Dark Angel dex it would basically invalidate the much of the army builds and make it just another vanilla marine army.
If my opponent brought 2 baneblades hell ye i wanna play that, but be fair about the game lets make a special scenario and let me make it fair by beefing up my army.

Last edited by Stormxlr; 02-03-14 at 10:18 PM.
Stormxlr is offline  
post #8 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 07:28 PM
Rattlehead
 
MidnightSun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: New Sheoth
Posts: 6,741
Reputation: 83
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sethis View Post
The only special character that is/was even vaguely powerful is/was Mephiston, and even he had answers such as Plasma.
I'm not really sure what you mean here. Do you mean powerful as in beating people up? In which case, Mephiston's hardly the lord of beatsticks (damn good, to be sure, but I'd rather fight him than Abaddon or the Swarmlord).

I assume you don't mean powerful as in how strong an option they are and how good their abilities are, because I know you know that Sliscus, Coteaz and, I dunno, maybe Logan Grimnar are really strong choices despite being merely 'ok' in a fight.

Creator of Utilitarian Ultramarines Memes - join the XIII on Facebook (no XVII allowed).
MidnightSun is offline  
post #9 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 07:34 PM
Senior Member
 
Stormxlr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 443
Reputation: 7
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MidnightSun View Post
I'm not really sure what you mean here. Do you mean powerful as in beating people up? In which case, Mephiston's hardly the lord of beatsticks (damn good, to be sure, but I'd rather fight him than Abaddon or the Swarmlord).

I assume you don't mean powerful as in how strong an option they are and how good their abilities are, because I know you know that Sliscus, Coteaz and, I dunno, maybe Logan Grimnar are really strong choices despite being merely 'ok' in a fight.
Sadly i have not had a chance to face those, but i found Belial with sword to be quite amazing melee character. Midnight since you also play DA how do you place him against those characters?
DWA Belial with group of knights at right position can turn the tide of the game or completely end it in my favour. With good dice rolling you can slaughter everything in your path.
Stormxlr is offline  
post #10 of 44 (permalink) Old 02-03-14, 07:36 PM
Senior Member
 
kiro the avenger!'s Avatar
kiro the avenger!'s Flag is: England
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Where you least expect it
Posts: 1,509
Reputation: 3
Default

I'm fine with them, I do hate things like marbo though, but that has nothing to do with his name, just that he's a 'remove one squad' button for guard and at dirt cheap.
But they can be cool and give me a surprise when I find out a speacial rule they have and I'm 'hmm, cool but he's dead... Sorry' like we I challenged a tau battle suit with my sergeant, then found out he had an onager gauntlet as he bitch slapped me into the floor... That was fun and it didn't stop my termie sarg wipe out the whole squad next turn- he killed 3 crisis squads, one a body guard with commander in as many turns :D

........
Through temptation and horror
I have held to my faith
As a drowning man grasps at a rock
Judge me not by my weakness
Remember not my sins of late
kiro the avenger! is offline  
Reply

  Lower Navigation
Go Back   Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums > Warhammer 40K > General 40k

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome