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post #611 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Magpie_Oz View Post
If the new 'dex is so rooted, just imagine how much of an awesome achievement your victories will be.
It's amusing, as someone who still calls himself a sisters player, to see people whine and cry havoc over the last Eldar codex. The one with the T8 gunships that are faster than everything I have and cost less than a properly kitted Daemon prince while being stronger overall and that can be healed on top of that.

I've been mulling over CSM as well, which is my secondary army, and the more 6e codexes come out the more it shows they're paying the price for being the first: it's not bad, but damn there's so many overpriced models that go down burning if you so much as glare in their direction.

Like, I keep hearing complaints about striking scorpions and banshees, what should I say about Khorne Berzerkers? Or Mutilators? Or Warp Talons?

The Eldar codex looks a lot smoother and well-rounded than the first 6e products, there's quite a noticeable evolution from the days of the Chaos Marine 'dex and it's still not obviously and ludicrously broken, unless until the 5e era when the next codex had to beat the previous in a dick-waving race through the orbit; anyone remember Grey Knights and Necrons? They didn't come out so long ago that everyone is justified in forgetting them.

I have another one in my group that is violently whining that Eldar are now unplayable and, worst of all, he says he's going to play Sisters from now on, because apparently Sisters are overpowered because they have a 3+ armour save. I don't even.
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post #612 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 01:10 PM
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Hi,

i got some questions regarding the new codex:

1.) How much does a wraithguard actually cost now, like 2 and a half Guardian or 5 Guardians -15? (didn't get the "-15 for 5")

2.) Are Wraithlords still monstrous creatures? didn't see it mentioned?

Maybe someone could help me out^^
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post #613 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Cyberias View Post
Hi,

i got some questions regarding the new codex:

1.) How much does a wraithguard actually cost now, like 2 and a half Guardian or 5 Guardians -15? (didn't get the "-15 for 5")

2.) Are Wraithlords still monstrous creatures? didn't see it mentioned?

Maybe someone could help me out^^
1. 3 points cheaper than they used to be.

2. Yes, they're mostly the same except a lot more expensive and 3 attacks.
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post #614 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 01:28 PM
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Define what you consider a lot more.

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post #615 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 01:40 PM
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thx, i came up with another question =), again bout the Wraithguards:

"The whole unit may exchange their Wraithcannons for D-Scythe", does this mean you gotta change the whole units weapons to D-Scythes or can you choose to just give like 2 of them a scythe?
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post #616 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by scscofield View Post
Define what you consider a lot more.
Their base cost is 4/3 of what it used to be, and then you have to add on guns.
Depending upon their loadout, they end up being 30-40 points more.
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post #617 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyberias View Post
thx, i came up with another question =), again bout the Wraithguards:

"The whole unit may exchange their Wraithcannons for D-Scythe", does this mean you gotta change the whole units weapons to D-Scythes or can you choose to just give like 2 of them a scythe?
All of them have to switch.
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post #618 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 02:13 PM
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Winterous! Talk to me about Asurmen!

(My codex won't arrive till Monday)
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post #619 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by GrizBe View Post
Typically the new codex has an FAQ already.... looks like they put the wrong profile in for the Shadow Weaver:

Codex Eldar FAQ
Yeah this was actually up at least a week ago, setting a new record. Not that anyone was surprised there were typos in a GW book.

Overall Exarchs sound right to me, they're a better statline within a group of already dedicated Eldar. Thing that gets me is that I almost always used the twin catapult DA Exarch and bladestorm spammed because it was just all sorts of fun. Trading that for a twin linked weapon and no extra spam makes me sad. Of course being the only option I ever found tempting I could see a reason to deemphasize it.

Pity about the Wraithguard weapon being all or nothing. Already have a small set and was hoping to mix them in if anything. Wraithlord being more expensive almost doesn't bother me if it gets 3 attacks. Nothing incredible but with 2 you end up tar pitted by everything and anything with that WS4.

I think so far I would agree with Mokuren on this book. It is following a tone and one I hope the other books follow and quickly. When every flyer is compared to a vendetta your game might have an issue. I had hoped they fixed what 6 ed broke from the last book but this at least sounds functional. I would rather have Banshees able to thwack Terminators without random luck on every level but I guess they could be Warp Talons, who look scary, have an interesting sounding ability, but due to the rules are best as a support charger.
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post #620 of 643 (permalink) Old 06-01-13, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
*snip*
I do so enjoy it when people ignore my replies to things so let me start by replying to your previous post again:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
It's genuinely awful.
You keep saying that, but that's an opinon, not an actual fact.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Exarch powers don't make any sense, they should benefit the unit, and most of them are awful anyway.
Old Exarch powers are already rolled into the unit's special rules so now their powers are used to boost the Exarch to provide bonuses in different ways. Increased combat effectiveness through different bonuses (better at assault, ect).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Warlocks can't determine their powers before they get split off to units.
Warlocks only pair with Guardian based units and their powers only buff them and their unit or work against an enemy unit. Also quit bitching that the army has to use the same kind of mechanics for psychic powers everyone else does. Warlock powers are all pretty good. Just plan around the rolls like everyone else does instead of complaining. Adapt and improve.

EDIT: Actually I was a bit off on this now having a chance to look at the summary page. Yes the Warlocks have to be in the unit first, but unless you're playing an all Guardian list I can't imagine this being an issue honestly. Even a full Seer Council will end up with an interesting mix of powers. I still say learning to get used to the random power mechanic is important because that's how 6th balances powers. You don't have to pay for them anymore, but you can't choose them either.

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Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Wraith Lords are far too expensive now.
And before the update people playing against Eldar bitched they where too cheap. So now your T8 monsterous creature isn't under 100 points base? So what? He lost Wraithsight, is a more powerful MC due to the MC rules this edition, gained an attack in close combat, gets the Ghostglaive the same cost as a Meltabomb (3x S9, AP2 attacks? Yes, that IS better than before).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
The fliers are made of paper, for their cost they die far too easily.
No one ever seems to be happy with fliers. They're either too expensive and underpowered, or undercosted and broken. No matter what GW did with the Eldar flyers I'm willing to bet someone would bitch.

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Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Scorpions are pretty much unusable now, the Mandiblasters change neutered them pretty harshly.
So they lost a basic attack and gained Impact Hits that go off -every turn- and this is somehow bad?

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Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
The Psychic Powers are mostly garbage, and the lack of reliability is extremely un-Eldar; they should be able to re-roll their power rolls, or at least Farseers should.
Welcome to 6th Edition where everyone's psychic powers are getting toned down.

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Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Starcannon are still terrible and overpriced (except on a few things, but they're still bad overall).
This is the same arguement from 4th Edition. Tell me again how that book was so much better exactly?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
The Wraithknight's weapon options are awful, the sword is worth LESS than his standard weapons by far, and the Suncannon is ludicrously expensive. It can't even fire more than two weapons (meaning you can't take advantage of the Scatter Laser's great ability properly).
Sword gives you a different set of options. Take Scatterlasers, take Sword go tank and MC hunting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Fire Dragons are far more expensive than they should be.
They got a 3+ Armour save, gained the ability to run and then shoot and are paying for it. Also last edition they were cheap enough that they were the automatic anti-tank suicide squad. Yeah, I'm glad we're moving away from suicide squads in an army of a race that laments losing even a single Eldar.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
There's basically no point in taking the Warp Spider Exarch, since his powers are all terrible and massively overpriced (TWIN LINKED GUN ON A BS5 MODEL, REALLY?), and you don't really gain a damn thing from him being there.
He has other options you know. And BS5 with twin-linked just means you're chances of hitting are like 5.5/6 instead of 5/6. It makes him a more reliable shot which isn't a bad thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Most of the Phoenix Lords are just plain bad, and don't do what they should, which is modify the FOC to favour their aspect and provide buffs to the unit they join (like all Exarchs should do).
Phoenix Lords didn't do that last edition and everyone got -far- too over-hyped thinking they'd do it this edition. I'm sorry, but we don't need armies of Fire Dragons running around (which is exactly what would happen, and if Fire Dragons were the only ones to not be able to score people would bitch about that too).

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Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Yriel is a shadow of his former self.
I've never seen him played, but from a rules standpoint he seems about the same to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Eldrad is way too expensive for how massively gimped he is.
Oh no, the last edition's auto-include for nearly every Eldar army went up in points to represent how badass he actually is? Say it isn't so!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
They now have basically no Psychic defenses, which makes absolutely no sense.
Again, welcome to 6th. This is the way it is for almost everybody. On the flipside you have an easier time casting Blessings this edition anyways.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
Runes of Warding and Witnessing are nothing like what they ought to be.
Sorry, but they were broken in 6th. While they may have gone a little too heavy on the Nerf Hammer, it was the right choice. You can be mad if you want to, but honestly it had to happen.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
The person who authored this codex should be ashamed, they have absolutely no goddamn idea what the Eldar are all about, and have written a horribly underpowered waste of money.
I'm sorry but Phil-Motherfucking-Kelly and Jes-Goddamn-Goodwin know more about what the Eldar "should" be like than you ever will. Compare the Eldar codex to the other 6th Edition books. It's about the same power level. That's good for the game, good for the hobby, and your crying about it won't change it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
This book is practically unusable in competitive play, there's a lot of good changes (battle whatever and shuriken weapons being two of them), but almost everything else has been made absolutely awful.
Again, you've shown an opinion blinded by nerd-rage rather than taking the time to stop jerking your knee about and actually adjust to the way the game is being designed in this edition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterous View Post
It's offensive, they've shown an absolute lack of respect and understanding of one of the most interesting and important 40k races, and the entire codex needs to be re-written by someone who actually knows how Eldar should work.
No, you've shown a lack of respect to the people who've been working their ass off to bring us as many codexes as they can, as fast as they can, with better internal and external balance to each other. You've tried claiming that the two people in Games Workshop who are basically the parents of what you consider to be "Eldar" don't know what they're doing.

You sir, have shown less respect and understanding to their hard work, and dedication and have only chosen to bitch because your new codex isn't the King of Shit Mountain. It's shameful and frankly rather sad.

6th Edition is Games Workshop returning quite firmly to the Beer and Pretzels style of gameplay. Of course the codex isn't designed to be the next big thing. None of the 6th Edition codexes are. They're designed to be well balanced with a large range of equally good options to use with the new toys not being designed to replace old ones and old toys not being made worse to spotlight the new ones.

This is not 5th Edition. This isn't the same kind of game 5th was, and frankly I hope we keep going down this road because it's about tighter balance, and having a more enjoyable experience with your friends than crushing your opponent's army with the newest and more shiniest of toys. Now you can disagree with it if you want to, but with these changes to how they approach balance, it will in the long run actually help the competitive scene because it puts all the armies on the same basic power level. This means to win you'll need to be better than your opponent, not just having deeper pockets than them.

Last edited by Zion; 06-01-13 at 03:40 PM. Reason: Warlock correction.
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