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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-04-16, 02:58 PM Thread Starter
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Default Eldar 2000pts list finishing



Iím stuck on how to finish my latest Eldar listÖ

Firstly, I play against marines all the time. I canít remember the last time I fought an army without T4 3+. Iíve decided to go for firepower as the cc aspects just donít cut it against marines without serious buffing (10 scorpions, karandras, eldrad and 2 spiritseers worked as a unit Ė it just didnít kill enough to be worth it)
Iím staying off the wraithguard for now Ė I have a list planned and the models bought but when I do wraith, itís going to be a whole list of wraith.

Iím settled on taking a cad, a seer council and an aspect shrine. The seer council and the rangers sit on objectives and hide. Then when reserves come in, the dark reapers in the falcons deep strike (36Ē away from the biggest concentration of enemy) and open fire while the hemlock goes vehicle hunting. Iím using the hemlock as I think itís by far the best looking plane in 40k.

Aspect shrine

5 Dark Reapers
Exarch
5 x Starshot missiles


5 Dark Reapers
Exarch

5 Dark Reapers
Exarch

Seer Council
Farseer
Spirit stone of Anathlan

Farseer

10 x Warlock

Cad

5 x Rangers
5 x Rangers

3 x Falcon
3 x Starcannons

Hemlock Wraithfighter

I have about 200pts left. I need to bring a character to lead my cad. Which character would work best with this list - as in which phoenix Lord would help the council most?

Last edited by Gret79; 03-06-16 at 01:56 PM.
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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-14-16, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gret79 View Post

Iím stuck on how to finish my latest Eldar listÖ

Firstly, I play against marines all the time. I canít remember the last time I fought an army without T4 3+. Iíve decided to go for firepower as the cc aspects just donít cut it against marines without serious buffing (10 scorpions, karandras, eldrad and 2 spiritseers worked as a unit Ė it just didnít kill enough to be worth it)
Iím staying off the wraithguard for now Ė I have a list planned and the models bought but when I do wraith, itís going to be a whole list of wraith.

Iím settled on taking a cad, a seer council and an aspect shrine. The seer council and the rangers sit on objectives and hide. Then when reserves come in, the dark reapers in the falcons deep strike (36Ē away from the biggest concentration of enemy) and open fire while the hemlock goes vehicle hunting. Iím using the hemlock as I think itís by far the best looking plane in 40k.

Aspect shrine

5 Dark Reapers
Exarch
5 x Starshot missiles


5 Dark Reapers
Exarch

5 Dark Reapers
Exarch

Seer Council
Farseer
Spirit stone of Anathlan

Farseer

10 x Warlock

Cad

5 x Rangers
5 x Rangers

3 x Falcon
3 x Starcannons

Hemlock Wraithfighter

I have about 200pts left. I need to bring a character to lead my cad. Which character would work best with this list - as in which phoenix Lord would help the council most?
o.
what is the average per-model points cost here?
50?

Given the makeup of the army, you can really only chose one phoenix lord i would imagine...
mr. m.ra
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-30-16, 08:06 AM Thread Starter
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That's a good point... it's an expensive list

I narrowed the phoenix lords down to Baharroth or Jain Zar - it just comes down to whether the mask of -5 ws + init is worth more to the seer council than hit and run.

Maugan-Ra would be great if I didn't only fight marines
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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-30-16, 07:02 PM
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My Eldar experience is not that wide. But why are you using a seer council of 10 warlocks? Wouldn't it be better to only run 7 to save the points? You still start with 3 powers and get to choose which one you loose when one dies (there will probably be a power you don't care for anyways). Also 9 is a great number for a unit as 25% is bumped to 3 models (same as 12 models).

The point is that warlocks are going to get destroyed by the marines in CC anyways (flesh bane is nice, but no AP3).

Also, I'd recommend Scatter Lasers or Shuriken Cannons rather than Star Cannons, as a cover save is going to make the Star Cannons not as effective (unless you are fighting TEQs or maps with little cover)

I love the Hemlock Wraithfighter though, make sure you give one of the Farseers Telepathy for the lolz!

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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-31-16, 03:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gret79 View Post
That's a good point... it's an expensive list

I narrowed the phoenix lords down to Baharroth or Jain Zar - it just comes down to whether the mask of -5 ws + init is worth more to the seer council than hit and run.

Maugan-Ra would be great if I didn't only fight marines
but...
it breaks my brain to think that any other phoenix lord would be there.
i mean, there are ZERO banshees.
ZERO swooping hawks.

i could see an autarch with banshee and hawk kit,
maybe with a small unit of shee or hawk,
but...
i just do not understand how to justify a banshee phoenix lord leading an army with zero banshees.
impossible in my brain.
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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-31-16, 04:46 AM
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So what @jin ? Pheonix lords are drawn to wars and follow the path of the bloody handed god. Some times that might mean they are on their own, other times they might lead aspect warriors of their shrine.

Though I'm surprised someone like you, who claims to revolve more around fun and the fluff, couldn't think of a way to justify either of those choices. I mean just because the pheonix lord is chosen doesn't mean it must be that pheonix lord. Perhaps it's a 'special' aurarch leading Grets force.

Instead of Baharroth it's an autarch that walked the swooping hawk, dire avenger, and warp spider paths. Or instead of Jain Zar it's an aurarch that walked banshee and striking scorpion paths.

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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-31-16, 07:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darkreever View Post
So what @jin ? Pheonix lords are drawn to wars and follow the path of the bloody handed god. Some times that might mean they are on their own, other times they might lead aspect warriors of their shrine.

Though I'm surprised someone like you, who claims to revolve more around fun and the fluff, couldn't think of a way to justify either of those choices. I mean just because the pheonix lord is chosen doesn't mean it must be that pheonix lord. Perhaps it's a 'special' aurarch leading Grets force.

Instead of Baharroth it's an autarch that walked the swooping hawk, dire avenger, and warp spider paths. Or instead of Jain Zar it's an aurarch that walked banshee and striking scorpion paths.
yeah, man, i understand where you are coming from.
sometimes, i wonder why i stick on some things and not others.
i guess no one is ideally reasonable, at all times.
call it preference for internal logical consistency.
for a one-off battle, i can totally see jain zar showing up at the right time and place,
and this is easily made into a very cool narrative (warned by warp flux, the warlock council resonate their direst needs through the fabric of space, and jain zar hears their call to lead them when and where she is needed)...
but as an army that i plan to play over and again, well, i am not able to compute that ...
maybe my limitation.
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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-03-16, 10:01 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by TheV0791 View Post
My Eldar experience is not that wide. But why are you using a seer council of 10 warlocks? Wouldn't it be better to only run 7 to save the points? You still start with 3 powers and get to choose which one you loose when one dies (there will probably be a power you don't care for anyways). Also 9 is a great number for a unit as 25% is bumped to 3 models (same as 12 models).

The point is that warlocks are going to get destroyed by the marines in CC anyways (flesh bane is nice, but no AP3).

Also, I'd recommend Scatter Lasers or Shuriken Cannons rather than Star Cannons, as a cover save is going to make the Star Cannons not as effective (unless you are fighting TEQs or maps with little cover)

I love the Hemlock Wraithfighter though, make sure you give one of the Farseers Telepathy for the lolz!
The seer council has 10 warlocks so it can take a couple of casualties before losing mastery levels - With this list having something like 18 warp charge a turn, I need enough psychic powers to take advantage
Any marines cc'ing the seer council will be within 6" of Jain Zar so will get a -5 ws and init debuff. So they'd be hitting last and only on a 5+ at best. If I got a good roll on telepathy invisibility would also be nice
but If I went second, a couple of drop pods on turn one with flamers would probably completely ruin the council before it gets to do anything.
The falcons having star cannons is because they get no-scatter deep strike so I should be able to mitigate cover. I discounted shuriken cannons because of the shorter range and scatterlasers as I never seem to kill anything with them. Also (and mainly) wysiwyg - I've not changed the guns since 3rd ed

Quote:
Originally Posted by jin View Post
yeah, man, i understand where you are coming from.
sometimes, i wonder why i stick on some things and not others.
i guess no one is ideally reasonable, at all times.
call it preference for internal logical consistency.
for a one-off battle, i can totally see jain zar showing up at the right time and place,
and this is easily made into a very cool narrative (warned by warp flux, the warlock council resonate their direst needs through the fabric of space, and jain zar hears their call to lead them when and where she is needed)...
but as an army that i plan to play over and again, well, i am not able to compute that ...
maybe my limitation.
If it makes you feel better, this list is for one game

I've a lot of eldar and I tend to use a new list in every game.

If I try a list and its poor, I spend time tweaking it to be more effective. If I make a list that annihilates everything on the table, I don't tend to run it again. If a game wasn't fun for the 2 or so hours it took to play then I've lost regardless of the outcome

My next list - I bought some converted Dark Eldar cold one knights to use as exodites (shining spears). Again, I've 200 or so points left to play with - what would fit in with the list beneath (fluffy or rules based, I really don't mind )

Illic Nightspear
Karandras

5 x Rangers
5 x Rangers

3 x Falcon
3 x Starcannon

Aspect Host +1 BS
5 Dark Reapers
Exarch

5 Dark Reapers
Exarch

5 Dark Reapers
Exarch
Star shot missiles

Aspect Host +1 WS
5 Shining Spears
Exarch
Star Lance

6 Striking Scorpions
Exarch
Scorpions Claw

10 Striking Scorpions
Exarch
Scorpions Claw

Last edited by Gret79; 04-03-16 at 10:23 PM.
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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-04-16, 03:39 AM
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i like that i do not see any spamknight in your lists.
personally, i refuse to own a wraithknight.

if it were me, i would
take only one named character (Karandaras).
convert him up righteously and put him on a tall base.
use the other character as an autarch.

i would add some psychic presence...
probably think about converting up some exodite "guardians"
add your platforms there,
maybe add warlocks or a basic farseer

again, per model point cost is high.
maybe drop a few reapers.
is the minimum squad size still 3?
or keep 2 of 5 units and trade the other unit for dire avengers...

i know, after all this it becomes a different list.
but, crazy as it may be,
this is where i would be leaning if i were building an eldar army.

actually, i have a bunch of eldar
and am waiting on the other half to be shipped (someday?),
but have been thinking off and on about how to put them together.
i am certain that i want to use harlequin,
which are so expensive points-wise.
so i need to balance.
so plan to convert old metal harlequin bikes into "guardian" bikes
(not scat bikes, tho, as i cannot see the virtue in that type of japanese porn),
use new bike kits to build a harlequin formation of some sort,
then add some craftworld eldar with some rangers for support.
i like the multiple small units approach here cuz then i get to include the variety that i want to see.
but i need to keep average model point cost low (in my mind) at the same time.
i want to have a small unit of stormguardians,
some minimal units of guardians with platforms maybe,
some vaul's engines that i converted 10 years ago,
pay the vyper tax,
a unit of dire avengers,
a unit of spiders,
a unit of banshees,
a minimal unit of reapers,
a falcon because i like it,
wraithlord cuz i like it,
points are hard to keep low!
my plan is to model up about 2500 points and get rid of the rest,
play from this pool forever while i work on other armies/projects.
being old, i like this approach more than chasing the winning list.
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