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post #71 of 74 (permalink) Old 04-30-14, 05:37 PM
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I'm gonna admit that I have no idea why people dislike Ventris, and yet, have no problem with Salamanders who are practically " human lovers. " They literally worship humans and value them as if they were their own battle brothers. So as for Ventries goes, he's still fine to me. A little bit too caring, yes, but I imagine that's all cause of Guiliman's influence. Afterall, Astartes do inherit qualities from their primarchs and way of thinking, especially when you're among the most successful primarchs in the great crusade, as well as your own mini Empire. Pride n shit.

I agree that Ventris should have in no way been able to defeat a shard of Nightbringer, or survive on a freaking demon planet, but hey, he's the main protagonist.
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post #72 of 74 (permalink) Old 04-30-14, 08:59 PM
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The whole shtick of the Salamanders (besides the fire-ash-forge-fire fetish) is that they are the most humane chapter, after all--and while sure, an Ultramarine doesn't have to be a zealous, intolerant crusader like the Black Templars, I really think AD-B tapped into something with the "slightly autistic, out of sync with regular humans" view of space marines.

Additionally: Ventris was a chance to make the Ultramarines interesting, and was squandered. The magnum opus of the most brilliant tactical mind in the Imperium, a book tens of thousands of pages long, is (I imagine) going to teach you a whole lot more about warfare than it does tie you up to formulaic limitations. It's not going to be a book that forbids taking the initiative or attacking where your opponent doesn't expect/is weak.

The Ultramarines aren't supposed to be hidebound vanilla marines any more than Abaddon is supposed to be a laughable, mustache-twirling failure. Those are just memetic ideas bouncing around in the fanbase, not the They are exemplars of discipline and crisp tactical flexibility. The Second Founding was entirely based around the Ultramarine principles of the Chapter, and the majority of chapters are directly descended from their gene-seed. You may recoil to hear it*, but Matt Ward was right when he said most chapters look up to the illustrious, pedigreed, honored Ultramarines.

And McNiell's Ultramarine books... are decent space marine stories, but I can't help but feel they don't do credit to that legacy or sense of grandeur. Have only read the first omnibus, true, but still...

*and I agree that last SM codex gave them too much of the spotlight

CSM Plog, Tactica

What sphinx of plascrete and adamantium bashed open their skulls and ate up their brains and imagination? Imperator! Imperator!
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post #73 of 74 (permalink) Old 04-30-14, 09:23 PM
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laughable, mustache-twirling failure
But, Abbadon doesn't have a stache o.o
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post #74 of 74 (permalink) Old 04-30-14, 09:27 PM
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I have not read 100% of the replys but skimmed enough. Uriel is not a strict Codex adherant seems to have come up a few times. You must not forget, Uriel is former Deathwatch. This alone changes a Space Marine and radically changes their outlook. If you read Blood of Asaheim you can see how deep it can affect a space marine.

I have enjoyed the Ventris novels if some are pretty farfetched...even for space marines.
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