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post #131 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-02-16, 08:37 PM
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Still think it's chaos driven. The hints are there with the inquisition guys talking about how the orks are distracting everyone from the 'real' enemy.
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post #132 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-02-16, 09:26 PM
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Still think it's chaos driven. The hints are there with the inquisition guys talking about how the orks are distracting everyone from the 'real' enemy.
The inquisition isn't the most reliable source for information though.
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post #133 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-03-16, 01:34 AM Thread Starter
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Well bear in mind this is post the first black crusade, they are trying to keep the attention on the traitor legions. From what ive understood, its believed that the first black crusade was the last hurrah of the traitor legions after the horus heresy. So the imperium is content to ignore them in face of other problems, and that complacency is whats bothering the ordo malleus inqusitors.

Remember, the Emperor himself granted the Malleus remit to the inquisition.

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post #134 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-03-16, 02:08 PM
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I'm not sure it does. In my head the ork threat is explosive it's directed at one target in a huge wave of aggressive anger and hate which just overwhelms in its power. It's a likely to implode on itself as it is to emerge victorious. This is different and I sense a controlling mind which is decidedly unorky. To control the orks natural power which is rooted in explosive power would take someone who has the ability to harness the orks natural connection to the warp.

I don't think this takes away at all from the orks power. It is exactly how orks, in 40k, work.

Whether the 40k ork makes for a good ork is a different argument. The 40k ork isn't like the organised brutal regiments we see in other fantasy genres. But they are what they are.
It's implying that to be a massive threat on the scale of the Beast, the Orks have to be guided by some external power...they can't just do it by themselves
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post #135 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-03-16, 05:06 PM
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Yeah I agree about selling Orks short with the theory. The books explain clearly that Orks evolve not only just physically in terms of strength and size, but also socially, culturally, technologically, on a strategic level as well and what not. Hell, you could consider them as grim-dark version of Pokemon almost.

It imposes the question just how powerful Orks could be/get and where's the actual limit. Personally the Beast and his Waaagh impressed me greatly and I dont think I'll ever look at Orks in the same light.
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post #136 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-03-16, 05:36 PM Thread Starter
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Losing the Beast as their unifying force. shows just how much their 'Emperor' matters to them. It must have been crippling on a truly apocalyptic level to lose their central lynchpin gluing them together.

Especially when you look at history, it taking eight thousand years before a potential successor to the Beast emerges at last without getting eliminated. Ghazkull's presence is clearly having a similar transformative effect on the orks.

The old ones did their work well when they crafted the orks.
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post #137 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-03-16, 07:49 PM
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Still think it's chaos driven. The hints are there with the inquisition guys talking about how the orks are distracting everyone from the 'real' enemy.
saying that the orks are distracting everyone from the real enemy does not mean they are chaos driven.

I would personally not like the idea of chaos being behind it, as if the orks needs chaos to be so devastating ?

That being said, I have no real idea how the ork invasion compares to the time of ending/crimson path, in all honesty I have the impression that the ork invasion is the 13th crusade squared ?
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post #138 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-03-16, 08:04 PM Thread Starter
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Do remember that the orks have had such a staggering level of success due to the Imperium simply being unbelievably complacent and still reeling from the peacetime mindset.

A brutal wake up call for sure, Abbadon sure wasted a golden time to strike at the Imperium imho. Look at the orks, they managed to threaten Terra! Abbadon never got that far.

While an argument could be made for wanting to step in and maul the pieces after the Beast spent himself, the Imperium would still be on a war footing and looking to respond to trouble.
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post #139 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-03-16, 09:19 PM
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Do remember that the orks have had such a staggering level of success due to the Imperium simply being unbelievably complacent and still reeling from the peacetime mindset.

A brutal wake up call for sure, Abbadon sure wasted a golden time to strike at the Imperium imho. Look at the orks, they managed to threaten Terra! Abbadon never got that far.

While an argument could be made for wanting to step in and maul the pieces after the Beast spent himself, the Imperium would still be on a war footing and looking to respond to trouble.
I have to disagree, If Abaddon attacked now when the orks are on the rampage he'd end up having to fight them at the same time as the imperium.

Waiting till after the war is over means that both sides are going to be depleted. If the imperium beats the orks they're still going to be taking severe losses crippling them for centuries.

If the orks win then there's probably going to fight themselves.

WARNING SPECULATION AHEAD

We know that vulcan is going to play a role some how. We also know that Vulcan is not around in the 40K setting.

We also know that Terra is still around meaning the orks were stopped. Meaning that Vulcan had to have played a role somehow.

Since he's not around the imperium lost a figure head.
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post #140 of 238 (permalink) Old 04-03-16, 10:47 PM Thread Starter
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I think you misunderstood what I said. Why didnt abbadon take advantage of the complacent imperium and attacked. Instead of wasting a golden opportunity and letting the orks run off with the show? Its been a thousand years since the first black crusade if i remember right was sorta 500 years post the horus heresy.
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