Deathwatch army composition for tourney - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
40k Tactics Discuss the art of war in the 41st millenium. Exceptional topics will be stickied.

 1Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-28-17, 11:33 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
Knighty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 39
Reputation: 1
Default Deathwatch army composition for tourney

Hiya.
So i got a tournament coming up shortly and its only 1000pts.
I'm still trying to figure out a decent army for my tournamet. Last time i went to one in my area i got smashed because i couldn't close the distance or do enough damage on tanks.
So far i know there is a Black Templar player rocking literally 1000pts of bikes, A tau player with some devilfish and alot of troop, a nid player no idea what he's using, a necron player who's taking some mean stuff from what i've heard and 1-2 IG players, Skitarii, Grey Knight and Ork, possibly more

Thus far this is what my current list has, open to any ideas on what i should change/keep etc based on what i know i'm up against, still kinda new so anything helps.
The list is 996pts
HQ:
Watch Master/w Dominus Aegis relic

Troop:
1 Vet squad(2 infernus cannons, 2 frag, 1 Black shield/w SS and Heavy thunder Hammer, 1 Sarge w/ SS and Xenophase blade, 2 Deathwatch Shotguns)
1 Terminator /w Cyclone missile launcher
1 Devestator Squad (Detachment) 2 Grav Cannons /w Amps, 1 Lascannon and 2 normal marines.

Heavy Support:
1 Corvus Blackstar
-Twin linked lascannons
-Blackstar Missile Launcher
- Hurricane Bolter
- Infernum Halo Launcher

The veteran squad and terminator will allow me use either a Aquila Kill team or a Furor kill team, whilst the devestator squad and Corvus Black star should be able to take care of most Tanks i'll encounter (Depending on rolls obvs) And the Corvus will also be a fairly large issue for most players especially with the re-roll on fail jinxs. The watch master has the Dominus Aegis so that He can grant a 4+ invul to eithe squad depending on which one is more important based on what i versus. If my list is completely stupid, fine, needs improving refining lemme know all input is welcome and appreciated
Knighty is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-28-17, 06:56 PM
Senior Member
 
Shandathe's Avatar
Shandathe's Flag is: Netherlands
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,494
Reputation: 14
Default

Okay, I personally think you went nuts on the upgrades

Your Veteran Squad squeezes some 350 points in, I think, 8 models. Just because you CAN upgrade a model doesn't mean you HAVE to. Leave some 'normal' Veterans around that you can afford to lose. A bolter with Special Issue ammo is a very good weapon to begin with. Something like 5 Veterans with 2 DW Frag Cannons is distinctly more affordable and a very good close-range hunting squad. Toss in a storm shield if you want to catch low-AP hits.

For extra shenanigans, remember you can trade in the CCW instead of the bolter (and if you have no specified melee weapon, you're still assumed to have one!). This means your Veterans can be armed with Boltgun/DW Shotgun at no additional cost which lets you pick from an insanely good number of options at close(ish) range.

You can buy two of these for the price of your current Veteran squad and still have points left over.... So proposed, alter to taste:

Veterans x5
- 3 with Deathwatch Shotgun & Boltgun with Special Issue Ammo (alternatively, only 2 of these and one with Boltgun and Storm Shield instead, or toss in a Meltagun for dealing with vehicles)
- 2 with Frag Cannon ( & Boltgun, which you'll only ever use if you somehow find yourself in the 24" to 30" bracket)

While I can see the use for borrowing an SM Devastator squad, they'll keep you from using the Black Spear Strike Force (I think you're effectively Unbound right now) which seems costly for the benefit.


EDIT: Note, using the Watch Master only for giving a unit 4++ is a waste of his points. He needs to be out there clobbering people.

Ask not the Eldar a question, for they will give you three answers; all of which are true and horrifying to know.

Last edited by Shandathe; 02-28-17 at 07:02 PM.
Shandathe is offline  
post #3 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-28-17, 07:53 PM
Senior Moderator
 
darkreever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: New Jersey, little ways out of NYC
Posts: 6,989
Reputation: 25
Default

I'm kind of confused about the devestator squad and is that a lone terminator?

The devestator squad is part of the deathwatch force or is it a separate detachment?

Damnation is paved on good intentions; subtle and sugar coated or blunt and honest
A hero is someone who steps up when everyone else backs down.
Popularity is what people strive for when they lack the strength to be themselves.


Seriously, is it really that hard to write reviews without spoilers?

Reporting Posts - read this
darkreever is offline  
 
post #4 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-28-17, 08:39 PM
Senior Member
 
Shandathe's Avatar
Shandathe's Flag is: Netherlands
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,494
Reputation: 14
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by darkreever View Post
I'm kind of confused about the devestator squad and is that a lone terminator?

The devestator squad is part of the deathwatch force or is it a separate detachment?
Lone Terminator, yep. That's a Deathwatch thing. You can buy single Termies and give them pretty much any (both shooty and assault) Terminator weapon you want. Mind you, all DW models come at a premium in points.

Still, the Terminator is eligible to be used in 3 of the Kill Team formations (which can only have a limited number of models), which can optionally then fit in OTHER formations or be used as-is in the BSSF. Assembling a Black Spear Strike Force is like a Matryoshka doll of various bonuses.

Ask not the Eldar a question, for they will give you three answers; all of which are true and horrifying to know.
Shandathe is offline  
post #5 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-28-17, 08:45 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
Knighty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 39
Reputation: 1
Default

Cheers for the advice.

I've never actually thought of just running them with boltguns with special ammo i probs should spread out upgrades so i can have more bodies over one large group.

In regards to doing the Shotgun/boltgun combo i did some research on that and turns out you aren't actually allowed to do DW Shotgun w/ Boltgun this was clarified in the Deathwatch Errata so that sucked.

The only real benefit with the Black spear formation is giving all troops the deepstrike rule and re-roll on the warlords table. Given i still won't be able to field many men in total cause DW are point heavy i'd rather avoid using deepstrike.

If i remove the devestators i'd be mainly relying on my corvus for long range anti tank support and there won't be much terrain being used so if i wanted to get closer with metla to get the two dice or close in with a hammer etc it'd probs end badly.

Though yeah given the Watch master is a god at clobbering people to death it would probs be more effective to keep him out on his own, doing what he does best.

You've definitely given me some food for thought i'm gonna go and mess around with the listing abit and see what comes out thanks.
Knighty is offline  
post #6 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-28-17, 08:59 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
Knighty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 39
Reputation: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by darkreever View Post
I'm kind of confused about the devestator squad and is that a lone terminator?

The devestator squad is part of the deathwatch force or is it a separate detachment?
Like he said basically i can have 1 terminator on his lonesome and can add an additional 4 if i wanted to make a full squad. Or i can add a terminator to a veteran squad and make them into a kill team to give me some great re-rolls, like the furor kill team which allows all failed wounds and armor pens against units with the Troop battlefield roll to be re-rolled (RIP Ork/Nid hoards). There are other restrictions for these kill teams but essentially i can field Bikes, Terminators and Vanguard Veterans (Assault marines) As singular models with the option of adding more to form full squads or just attach them to veteran squads and so that they can make kill teams.

Hopefully that cleared it up and didn't confuse you even more
Knighty is offline  
post #7 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-28-17, 09:50 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
Knighty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 39
Reputation: 1
Default

Potential new list after mixing some stuff

HQ:
Watch Master (no relic)

Troop:
4 Veteran Squads (2 frag cannons, 2 infernus, 3 Stalker pattern, 3 DW Shotguns, 10 Normal bolters)
2 Terminators (1 Default, 1 Cyclone Launcher

Heavy Support:
Corvus Blackstar (All previous upgrades mentioned

EDIT: I don't actually have the codex on me so i don't know if thats over the point limit or not but from what i remember of the points cost i think its around 1000pts

Last edited by Knighty; 02-28-17 at 10:04 PM.
Knighty is offline  
post #8 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-28-17, 10:22 PM
Senior Member
 
Shandathe's Avatar
Shandathe's Flag is: Netherlands
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,494
Reputation: 14
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knighty View Post
Cheers for the advice.

I've never actually thought of just running them with boltguns with special ammo i probs should spread out upgrades so i can have more bodies over one large group.
Remember, your basic Veterans are essentially Sternguard. Special Issue ammo is fantastic.
Dragonfire rounds are good at clearing people out of cover, as well as removing things that rely on Jink saves (even glancing AV10 flyers),
Hellfire will wound those 6+ Toughness targets normal bolter fire can't handle (and remember, you're probably rerolling ones!),
Kraken is relatively subtle - Only slight improvement to AP and range over normal bolter rounds, which still works great on most 4+ (such as Fire Warriors and their drones, or Skitarii)
Last but definitely not least, Vengeance rounds. Slightly lower range, but AP3. Downside is that they occasionally explode, but if you're using the right Mission Tactics? You reroll ones to hit. The Deathwatch can use weapons that Get Hot with FAR less risk.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knighty View Post
In regards to doing the Shotgun/boltgun combo i did some research on that and turns out you aren't actually allowed to do DW Shotgun w/ Boltgun this was clarified in the Deathwatch Errata so that sucked.
Whoops. In my defense, I don't actually PLAY mine much. Sisters remain my primary army

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knighty View Post
The only real benefit with the Black spear formation is giving all troops the deepstrike rule and re-roll on the warlords table. Given i still won't be able to field many men in total cause DW are point heavy i'd rather avoid using deepstrike.
The main benefit in my eyes is the additional Mission Tactics switch, though the (near-obligatory) Warlord Trait reroll is also important. With a usual BS of 4, Rerolling 1s To Hit means you're rerolling half your misses (and helps avoid Gets Hot, as noted before). As for Deep Strike... that's what drop pods are for

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knighty View Post
Though yeah given the Watch master is a god at clobbering people to death it would probs be more effective to keep him out on his own, doing what he does best.
He's vulnerable on his own (esp. to S8 weaponry). Launch him from a Veteran squad or something similar If you're not sure he can earn his points back, replace him. A Chaplain will (for DW only slightly, it must be said) boost a squad's melee with Zealot, or better yet toss in one or two Librarians (2 ML2 libs will get you 5-10 psyker dice a turn, and you have a wide selection of Disciplines to choose from).

Ask not the Eldar a question, for they will give you three answers; all of which are true and horrifying to know.
Shandathe is offline  
post #9 of 41 (permalink) Old 02-28-17, 10:41 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
Knighty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 39
Reputation: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shandathe View Post
Remember, your basic Veterans are essentially Sternguard. Special Issue ammo is fantastic.
Dragonfire rounds are good at clearing people out of cover, as well as removing things that rely on Jink saves (even glancing AV10 flyers),
Hellfire will wound those 6+ Toughness targets normal bolter fire can't handle (and remember, you're probably rerolling ones!),
Kraken is relatively subtle - Only slight improvement to AP and range over normal bolter rounds, which still works great on most 4+ (such as Fire Warriors and their drones, or Skitarii)
Last but definitely not least, Vengeance rounds. Slightly lower range, but AP3. Downside is that they occasionally explode, but if you're using the right Mission Tactics? You reroll ones to hit. The Deathwatch can use weapons that Get Hot with FAR less risk.
I never actually thought of the special ammo and what they could do with that, wow thinking on it you're right bolters with special ammo are great.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Shandathe View Post
The main benefit in my eyes is the additional Mission Tactics switch, though the (near-obligatory) Warlord Trait reroll is also important. With a usual BS of 4, Rerolling 1s To Hit means you're rerolling half your misses (and helps avoid Gets Hot, as noted before). As for Deep Strike... that's what drop pods are for
I have a health appreciation on the re-rolls with gets hot weapons, saved my ass a few times. I don't actually have any drop pods sadly so i'd be actually deploying them without it so thats why i'd rather avoid it unless it proved to be a smart idea when up against other stuff

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shandathe View Post
A Chaplain will (for DW only slightly, it must be said) boost a squad's melee with Zealot, or better yet toss in one or two Librarians (2 ML2 libs will get you 5-10 psyker dice a turn, and you have a wide selection of Disciplines to choose from).
I sadly don't own a Chaplain either and only a sole Librarian. When it comes to melee i mainly try and keep my Black shields with the SS and Heavy thunder hammes alive, seeing as most times they are in small squads he usually gets the double attacks and another attack for charging so he's hitting 5 times with the monster S10 AP2 Insta killing hammer of all mighty cheese, Get him to attack something he gets re-rolls to failed wounds/armor pens with and its truly a devestating combo especially if mixed with a Sarge with xenophase blade against HQ's with the re-roll on successful invuls.

I'm confident in my watch masters ability to survive and get his points worth. I've done a fair few 2000-2500pt games and some lower point games and everytime he's come out alive and on top. (He's even gone up against a sizable Tyranid hoard single handed and come out on top which earned him much renown and love from myself). He's yet to fail me thus far so i'll keep him
Knighty is offline  
post #10 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-01-17, 08:27 AM
Senior Member
 
Shandathe's Avatar
Shandathe's Flag is: Netherlands
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,494
Reputation: 14
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knighty View Post
Potential new list after mixing some stuff

HQ:
Watch Master (no relic)

Troop:
4 Veteran Squads (2 frag cannons, 2 infernus, 3 Stalker pattern, 3 DW Shotguns, 10 Normal bolters)
2 Terminators (1 Default, 1 Cyclone Launcher

Heavy Support:
Corvus Blackstar (All previous upgrades mentioned

EDIT: I don't actually have the codex on me so i don't know if thats over the point limit or not but from what i remember of the points cost i think its around 1000pts
Firepower looks good. Note you could still kit one squad out for CC with a hammer to go with the Watch Master Getting to the other side of the battlefield on foot though... that's going to be an utter pain. Hrmm. No drop pods, suppose one squad could deploy from the Corvus... If you have one available, finding some points for a Rhino or Razorback would help immensely, I think. Rhino's probably plenty, seeing as how you can fire the heavy assault weapons from the hatch.

Mind you, I like my infantry mechanized. YMMV.

Ask not the Eldar a question, for they will give you three answers; all of which are true and horrifying to know.
Shandathe is offline  
Reply

  Lower Navigation
Go Back   Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums > Warhammer 40K > 40k Tactics

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome