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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-18-11, 10:55 AM Thread Starter
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Default Help me: confessions of a moronic Tyranid General

So I've been looking around the Tactica forum, I've been doing searches online but I cant really find the answers I'm looking for. The simple question I want to ask is...

How do you personally find the best way to use the 'insert unit name' is?

The problem I'm having is sifting through all the people that are just saying, dont use that unit, its useless. The other thing I'm coming up against is people saying, I find the best way to use this is in this specific army list, which is fine if I have an infinite number of different units at my disposal and I'm sick of freedom.

I dont play competatively, I play for fun. I dont really like arguing over the rules or anything (which seems to come up in tactics a bit). So ALL I'm asking is, if your willing to, could you tell me whats the best way you've used these units...

Lictor
Pyrovore
Carnifex
Mawloc

I know, I know, theres plenty of room for debate and complaint here (what units are useless, can the mawloc target units, blah blah blah, etc), but what I'm looking for here is not to start a negative thread. Im not trying to incite people bashing, codex author hate or any other kind of moaning/complaining/critasism.

So basically, anyone with decent experiences of using these would be cool, whether it was down to a bit of luck or especially if you've managed to use it more than once in a similar way. Not to say what what anyone did was a stupid idea, unlikely to work or anything. Just... I used this guy, it worked like this (and the person I played with accepted how I was using it with no argument) and I was pleased with the result.

thanks everyone : )

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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-18-11, 11:09 AM
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This might be of use:
Oddjob's Tyranid Synergy and Unit Analysis

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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-18-11, 11:29 AM
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lictor, i have had almost no experience of these but the time i did use them, they just died

Pyrovore, no use of these what so-ever

carnifex, they used to be awesome in the last edition but i feel for what you get the points is too much.

Mawloc, i love these guys! everyone says that the prime is better but i dont care, they have taken out enough terminator/marine units for me to call them defiantly worth it best moment with a Mawloc has to be when i anatillated a Grey knight terminator unit with them (the previous Deamon hunters codex it has to be said)

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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-18-11, 01:05 PM
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Lictor- used them a few times in 'fun' lists. They work great as a distraction and have helped me to bring in my harpy exactly where I have wanted it to be a few times. Overall I'd say just avoid them now, but if you must take them bring them down near enemy shooing units that don't have flamers and won't smoosh you in combat (ie no powerfists) and just laugh everytime the opponent declares a shot going their way...

Pyrovore- I have never used these things, but I'm almost half tempted to shove a couple in in a snot pod and use them as an anti-hoard strike force... forget that they have power weapons or any other special rules... they are rubbish except as a flamer unit.

Carnifex- if you want a walking combat moster then the trygon is simply better... for me the only 2 ways to run a fex that aren't simply outclassed by other options are either as a snot podding plasma cannon (mycetic spore and bioplasma) or in a unit of 3, likely with a tyranid prime to back them up. Either way they are probably far more points then they are worth.
... the fex is just the target of GW trying to sell more models: they were the must have in the old dex, so GW kept them in the dex to avoid a riot, but made them so rubbish that almost no-one would use them anymore.

Mawloc- I actually like the mawloc a little more then a trygon.. but then I don't use either (converted my only trygon boxset into my swarmlord). I would deploy from reserve, mostly for the psychological value (opponent will spread out all his units) and then have it jump on isoltaed unit: hit them when entering from reserve, kill them in combta then burrow down to redeploy. I don't think its worth using solely as a whack-a-mole popping up and down just for the blast template.


... that's my tactical views in a nutshell, but while I'll use the less-effective units that I own (like lictors) I won't go out and buy expensive models that I don't like (such as mawloc/trygon). Mostly my lists revolve around the elites section, stealers and biovores, but I'll use almost every option not on your list quite commonly.

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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-18-11, 04:25 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khrone forever View Post
lictor, i have had almost no experience of these but the time i did use them, they just died

Pyrovore, no use of these what so-ever

carnifex, they used to be awesome in the last edition but i feel for what you get the points is too much.
This is the kind of thing I was hoping to avoid ; ), but I'm appreciating your story about killing the GK (regardless of the codex they were in at the time).

Thanks Tim and/or Steve, I get models I like the look of too, even if they it does turn out that no one else uses them. I got some models before I relised what the rules were like for them, but it doesnt really bother me. I like to write fun and interresting lists, trying out different combinations of stuff. I wrote a list the other day that did quite well, but then the more I use the same list, the more annoyed I get with myself for being boring. I dont want my armies to turn into the 40K equivalent of a Robot Wars, self righting, wedge shaped flipping machine. it workes, so everyone uses it.

I keep reasuring my friends that when I get my Grey Knights army up and running its not going to be as unstoppable as they think, because I dont play to win, I play to enjoy. My lits are going to be full of things that dont make a lot of tactical sense, but I'm happy with them.

That said... it doesnt hurt to win once in a while, or more specifically for me to get my own little personal victories, like wanting a 'bad' unit to achieve something. I've only used the Pyrovore a few times and he hasnt really done a lot in any of the games. I refuse to bench him indeffinately though, so I just wanted to know if someone had used him and done something cool with him. Likewise with the Lictor. The carnifex's and the mawloc I havnet really used and just wanted some encouraging to use them, so maybe I'll pop a Mawloc in the next list I write, try him out... I'm just worried about him scattering into a building and ... thats the end of that.

If anyone else has got success stories about any of these units, I'd love to hear them. I used to put Rippers on this list of things Im rubbish at using, but since then theve taken a Landspeeder, Daemon Prince and a Wraithlord.

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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-11, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azwaz View Post
I used to put Rippers on this list of things Im rubbish at using, but since then theve taken a Landspeeder, Daemon Prince and a Wraithlord.
Erm... how? Rippers can't even hurt a Wraithlord, am I right? Even if they've got Poison, Wraithlords have two Flamers + another gun, and Str 10 striking at the same time/before you do. Again, Rippers can't hurt a Land Speeder even if they did hit it. Daemon Prince, maybe (with lucky rolls) but it IDs you, strikes before you, and at such a high WS that you hit back on 5s.

I think that it's down more to your luck than the Ripper's abilities that produced these jaw-dropping results.

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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-11, 01:17 PM
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I played tyranids back when the carnifex was the screamer killer and had the smushed in face, up to the codex just before the most recent one. The lictor has always been my favorite unit in the codex despite it never being 'ideal' in the eyes of competative play. A trend i've noticed is that it's gotten progressively weaker, and its point cost increased. If I recall correctly, (way back when) it used to have 3 or 4 wounds, at 60 points. Now its something silly like 2 wounds at 80? I tried time and time again to use them, but gave up when it dropped in and got beat down by 4 sniper scouts in CC.

Despite the negatives they did do useful things in some games. I'm sure im being redundant with these suggestions but the biggest thing is to keep your lictor(s) in mind when placing terrain at the start, and keep an eye for isolated shooty units. More times than not they are just a good distraction for a turn or 2 because of their deployment nature making them an immediate threat and will buy your other units some time.
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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-11, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by MidnightSun View Post
Erm... how? Rippers can't even hurt a Wraithlord, am I right? Even if they've got Poison, Wraithlords have two Flamers + another gun, and Str 10 striking at the same time/before you do. Again, Rippers can't hurt a Land Speeder even if they did hit it. Daemon Prince, maybe (with lucky rolls) but it IDs you, strikes before you, and at such a high WS that you hit back on 5s.
Buckets of dice and poison can kill just about any model without AV in the game, even more so if you manage to give them pref enemy. The rapelord can take his 2 attacks and kill 1 base while dying, thats quite ok as Tyranid. The DP is a bigger scalp for sure.

Furious charge makes the bugs S4 and once again a bucket of dice can do wonders, specially against AV10 models.


I too have memories of 2nd ed Lictors that could go toe to toe against SM captains without being instafisted in every way possible. I was generally on the recieving end though....
Lictors are fairly good tank hunters. Their shooting attack is ap- but still S6 rending which is more then enough to dent any rear armour. If they turn around to shoot them then your other part of the army should have a nice rear shot instead. They can not fail to get within range of the rear armour if you want them too. As long as you stun it youre golden the next turn with S6 rending CC attacks. Have seen 2 Lictors blow up a Baneblade (in CC though)

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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-11, 02:27 PM
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Thoughts on the Mawlock here:
https://www.heresy-online.net/forums/...hlight=mawlock

Fex's are ok, but in pure cc mode they are very easy to avoid (especially in DoW). the only way I would really consider running them is with 2x tl devourers as 12x st6 is pretty nasty. The unit can then be given an easy cover save by attaching primes or putting a gargoyle squad out in front. Just don;t fight against any rune priests.

Lictors are definately my favourite Nid unit in terms of fluff, but sadly they exist in a very competitive FoC slot. I have considered them in a mawlock heavy list for funsies, but don't really see hem as being great compared to the other elites choices.

In a list for the local club you'll have no issues with just sticking in a mawlock, carnifex and some lictors into a list, but be aware that they have quite a steep learning curve.


--edit--
The best (only?) way to use pyrovores is in a spod, deepstriking onto your opponent for some flamey death. They are very overcosted in this role. Actually, the modles could be used as biovores, which aint half bad.

Last edited by OddJob; 12-19-11 at 02:36 PM.
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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-20-11, 12:36 AM
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Just my views on the matter.

Carnifex - Personally I think I'd rather use 1 TL devourer and a stranglethorn. Force a pinning test at -1 LD per casualty, sign me up.

Lictors - Best unit we have for assaulting into cover since it basically acts as if it had offensive grenades. When assaulting into cover, you should plan to use fleet and stealth to keep them alive the turn they arrive so they can assault the subsequent turn.

Pyrovore - One of the few templates we get. Useful for anti-horde, pales in compairson to a Tyrannofex's anti-horde capabilities. Biggest benefit is power weapon except you'd have more efficiency using boneswords on a warrior if you're after that. It'd be cheaper AND provide Synapse.

Mawloc - I'd probably only use one with either a winged tyrant or a try prime. LD 8 to not assault with WS 3. 4 attacks on assault. I'd rather spend the extra 30 for a regular Try and get LD 8 to not assault with WS 5, 7 attacks on assault. Spend another 40 and you get a mobile Synapse for those pesky gargies, shrike, rippers, and raveners.

Oh and Oddjob, if you were gonna convert those to biovores, need to shave off a bit of the model and personally I'd give it a spore-mine emerging from the cannon.
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