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post #11 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-03-13, 02:56 PM
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Probably better to leave the numbers out, you can just assume we all know the implications of being granted stealth.

Just to clarify you only get the 6+ cover in the open if the firer is within 8" of you, not sure if you meant that as your post doesn't seem to read that way.
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post #12 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-03-13, 05:42 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Magpie_Oz View Post
Probably better to leave the numbers out, you can just assume we all know the implications of being granted stealth.

Just to clarify you only get the 6+ cover in the open if the firer is within 8" of you, not sure if you meant that as your post doesn't seem to read that way.
Yep-It should have been conveyed to that meaning, but I kinda skipped over it-Ooop's!
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post #13 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-03-13, 11:16 PM
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Yep-It should have been conveyed to that meaning, but I kinda skipped over it-Ooop's!
So what do you think?

Is this another "counts as" does not mean "is"

So the Dread counting as having assault grenades doesn't mean it can "throw" them?

If it can make a shooting attack with them by throwing, does that mean it is now a weapon ?
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post #14 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-03-13, 11:41 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Magpie_Oz View Post
So what do you think?

Is this another "counts as" does not mean "is"

So the Dread counting as having assault grenades doesn't mean it can "throw" them?

If it can make a shooting attack with them by throwing, does that mean it is now a weapon ?
Well the way I Understood it-it just gives the Dread the ability to launch grenades kinda like a scout does-Something you have to buy if you want to use grenades-but is not really a weapon -like popping smoke, what I like about it is having it gives you STEALTH Rules so you get Cover save, and a better cover save if your in cover. in addition you can use it when charging into terrain without losing charge points-or- use it on a squad about to assault you within the 8 inch and they lose their extra charge-If what I was told was correct

*just a reminder I'm asking you 40k masters-not telling-So I may still not have my facts right!

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post #15 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-04-13, 12:57 AM
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This is an easy one for me.
Grenades are weapons.
They are listed under the Weapon section of the main book.
They have Weapon profile lines where applicable.
A grenade is as much a weapon as a storm bolter is.
If a dread is armed with a storm bolter then that bolter is a weapon and can be destroyed.

The ironclad with assault launchers is now armed with assault and defensive grenades (and it does say 'armed' rather than 'equipped with' further singling them out as a weapon system)

Back in the day when grenades had no offensive power then they were basically just like smoke launchers, equipment and nothing else.

Now they actually can do damage. They have a weapon profile, they are listed in the rulebook as weapons. They are weapons. A piece of equipment that counts as a weapon is a weapon.

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post #16 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-04-13, 01:41 AM Thread Starter
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Clearly that makes perfect sense in this reality, but in 40k reality a sniper -someone with a precision Long range weapon and expertise skill -you would think a lot of training would be involved-has the same BS as anyone else-Ooop's sorry Snipers BS is not equal to SM using a pistol. But I rather the Grenade Launchers are a weapon choice-a weapon Fired-a weapon Destroyed.
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post #17 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-04-13, 02:26 AM
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Ooop's sorry Snipers BS is not equal to SM using a pistol
That's because the sniper in question is a Space Marine in training.

Glad to see some other people thinking they are weapons. I agree, Galahad. If it can shoot, it's a weapon on a vehicle that can be destroyed.

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post #18 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-04-13, 02:31 AM
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Well...in the IG it's typically the veteran and ratling units that get heavy access to sniper rifles. Both of those units have superior BS compared to regular guardsmen...and marines give their sniper rifles to raw recruits who aren't even full space marines yet so it's hardly surprising that they do not have superior bs compared to other marines. Every space marine started life as a sniper, so of course a fully fledged mrine is going to have the same or better shooting ability.

Plus the lethal accuracy of snipers is covered by the sniper weapon rule. A sniper rifle is so nasty because its user usually gets you in the vitals...if you're aiming for the vitals you're aiming at a smaller target and thus it takes more training to hit, giving them an overall comparable BS Someone with a sniper rifle can headshot you with the same ease as someone with a lasgun and the same bs trying to hit your chest...and conversely will miss just as often.

He can also do it from further away. Being able to hit a target just as well but from half-again the distance is a measure of accuracy as well

Also, that has fuck all to do with the fact that weapons are weapons and wargear that is a weapon is a weapon.

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post #19 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-04-13, 03:30 AM Thread Starter
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That's because the sniper in question is a Space Marine in training.
Dang! your Right! sorry my Sniper example went off topic- Anyways I know the ICD was released a few years back and it appeared everyone in my game store had to have one-when I looked at the model and saw the
launchers (as seen on C/R Land raider) most thought they were Armour .

that's what prompted my ? here-by now hasn't this come up before-anyone here played a ICD this way-I'm new to this-I cant be the first to ask-perhaps when an updated marine codex will have all this explained.
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post #20 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-04-13, 03:59 AM
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It doesn't really need to be explained.
Grenades are weapons.

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