What is the Astartes "Secret"? - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
40k Fluff Discuss GW background material here. All those bits in the Codex that aren't stat blocks or special rules. Post your custom character/chapter/army background in our Homebrew Fluff subforum!

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 06:49 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Diatribe1974's Avatar
Diatribe1974's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 953
Reputation: 1
Default What is the Astartes "Secret"?

In the novel by McNeill, (3rd book in the series in the Ultramarines Omnibus "The Killing Ground"), there was hinted at there being more to an Astartes than what they were currently at. By that, what I mean is:



What was being hinted at in the above mentioned spoiler?
Diatribe1974 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 07:23 AM
Senior Member
hailene's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 2,215
Reputation: 17
Default

I haven't read the books, but I'll take a shot:

I'm guessing it has to do with Chaos. Marines steel themselves against the temptations of the Chaos gods. Because they refuse to accept their "gifts" they are less capable. Maybe there's some psychic block that can be tampered with. The Eisenhorn series had plenty of psychic manipulations of minds that made people forget certain things or overwrite their entire personality.
hailene is offline  
post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 11:13 AM
Dazed and confused.
 
Khorne's Fist's Avatar
Khorne's Fist's Flag is: Ireland
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Posts: 8,496
Reputation: 105
Default

The original SM fluff in RT said marines were recruited from the ranks of prisoners and feral tribes, and were made to be psychotic killing machines that should not be let near the ordinary populace. Maybe it's a hint at this potential berzerker inside all marines. They must keep self control at all times? Just a thought.
Khorne's Fist is offline  
 
post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 01:25 PM
Senior Member
 
Weapon's Avatar
Weapon's Flag is: Ireland
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 492
Reputation: 1
Default

Well if they spit acid imagine what would happen if they pissed on something.

Yeah, there's your "big secret" right there.

Fire piss.

Weapon is offline  
post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 02:37 PM
Senior Member
 
locustgate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Planet 404
Posts: 2,353
Reputation: 11
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hailene View Post
I haven't read the books, but I'll take a shot:

I'm guessing it has to do with Chaos. Marines steel themselves against the temptations of the Chaos gods. Because they refuse to accept their "gifts" they are less capable. Maybe there's some psychic block that can be tampered with. The Eisenhorn series had plenty of psychic manipulations of minds that made people forget certain things or overwrite their entire personality.
Or cause them to have an anerism when someone mentions a name.
locustgate is offline  
post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 03:29 PM
Deathwing Commissar
 
Phoebus's Avatar
Phoebus's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Wandering...
Posts: 1,846
Reputation: 23
Default

I don't think it's a "secret" at all. Given the context of the actual statement...

“Your mind is closed to us,” said Lalla, “like a fortress preparing to resist an invader.”
“I don’t understand,” said Uriel.
“You Astartes, your minds are as rigid and unbending as adamantium,” said Kulla, and Uriel knew that her mouth was not moving. Her voice was arriving directly in his thoughts without recourse to speech. “You are trained, conditioned and enhanced in so many ways, but your minds are like locked doors to a place of miracles and wonder. All the potential you are trained to access: memory, language, combat analysis, and yet your masters train you to close off the one part of your mind that might actually allow you to soar. You do not feel as others do, but we can open that door for you if you let us.”
“Stop it, Kulla,” said Lalla. “You know that’s not allowed. Leave him to his blindness.”


... I'm pretty sure they are referring to the effects of the psycho-indoctrination Astartes are under. The same process that gives them some resistance to mental influence (as implied by Lalla, above) also deprives them of much of their free will, imagination, etc. That is, an Astartes is defined as much by his mental fortitude as he is by his physical prowess. If he were able to think for himself, to make his own choices, to have an open mind (as Kulla implies), he would no longer be Astartes.

This, by the way, ties in with the consistent themes the fluff has introduced on the Astartes. On the other hand, Graham McNeill would be rather remiss in introducing a dark secret regarding the Astartes which is neither found anywhere else in the fluff nor even mentioned again in his own novel...

Cheers,
P.
Phoebus is offline  
post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 04:34 PM
Dazed and confused.
 
Khorne's Fist's Avatar
Khorne's Fist's Flag is: Ireland
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Posts: 8,496
Reputation: 105
Default

Having read Phoebus' extract, might it have something to do with psychic potential? All the indoctrination and psycho conditioning they undergo must increase their capacity to use more of their brain, possibly including their psychic potential.

I'm not saying that all marines are potential librarians, but that they are more likely to develop than an unaugmented human.
Khorne's Fist is offline  
post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 04:37 PM
Senior Member
 
TRU3 CHAOS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 287
Reputation: 1
Default

They get laid. Thats there secret.

TRU3 CHAOS is offline  
post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 04:59 PM
Deathwing Commissar
 
Phoebus's Avatar
Phoebus's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Wandering...
Posts: 1,846
Reputation: 23
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Khorne's Fist View Post
Having read Phoebus' extract, might it have something to do with psychic potential? All the indoctrination and psycho conditioning they undergo must increase their capacity to use more of their brain, possibly including their psychic potential.

I'm not saying that all marines are potential librarians, but that they are more likely to develop than an unaugmented human.
There might be something to be said about that, as well. It occurred to me, and, don't get me wrong, I didn't dismiss it out of hand. I think it's a perfectly valid theory (no less than what I proposed), it's just I'd never seen anything like the sort expressed in any other fluff, before or since.

But it would be neat--perhaps something like that could be a catalyst for renegades overcoming their own psycho-conditioning prior to going rogue?

Cheers,
P.
Phoebus is offline  
post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-03-11, 07:23 PM
Senior Member
hailene's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 2,215
Reputation: 17
Default

That'd be silly, I think. Why lock away psychic potential? They have a system to deal with psykers within their ranks--the Librarians. The Space Marine codex tells us that potential recruits are screened for psychic talent and those found lacking are killed. Why would they cover up any latent psychic potential? Particularly the Ultramarines who have pick of 8 systems worth of recruits?
hailene is offline  
Reply

  Lower Navigation
Go Back   Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums > Warhammer 40K > 40k Fluff

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome