Space Marine chapter vs Dark age of Technology army, who would win? - Page 4 - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
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post #31 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-02-11, 09:34 PM
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Technology from the DAoT would be better but M41 would have better experience in fighting.

when you consider that almost all tech currently in use by M41 has a better/ more advanced version in the DAoT. Clone soldiers/ supersoldiers used in M41 have a grounding in DAoT because that would be where much of the tech has come from.

In Fleet based combat DAoT would hammer all Imperials into nothing, unless the imperium used their better grasp of warp travel to outflank the DAoT.

Ground based fighting would be close, but jetbikes, land speeders, land raiders, Original titans and baneblades etc. would throw down some hurt onto the M41 forces.

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post #32 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-02-11, 09:52 PM
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This comparison can't be made without knowing a lot of things that we... just don't know.

For instance, how prevalent/common was Dark Age of Technology military equipment? Additionally, was all of it all that? We think about the dreaded Men of Iron, for example, but reading the first "Tanith" novel, a Commissar and 2-3 Guardsmen not working well together and with 2-3 lasguns and a "barb lance" rifle between them manage to take out a Chaos Man of Iron. If Humanity during the Dark Age of Technology used Men or Iron as their predominate warriors (which indicates the average human soldier, if there were any, was probably not up to snuff--especially given that the Men of Iron overtook them), I'd feel very comfortable putting my money on an Astartes with power armour and a boltgun.

We also don't know the psychology of the soldiers of the time, though the fact that the Men or Iron were introduced to begin with indicates they would not have been nearly as ideologically fervent as Astartes. So how would a commander of fighting men deal with the kind of overwhelming, fanatical onslaught an Astartes force would bring to bear? What about the politicians he or she would answer to? Would they view surrender as a better option?

Too many questions to answer.
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post #33 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-02-11, 10:28 PM
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What you all need to take into consideration is that most of the STC designs, found by the Imperium, where never meant to be destined for war. Often, many of the vehicles had other purposes than war; Like the rhino was designed for crossing and exploring rough terrain. People didn't to wage wars back then, so they didn't care much for protective machinery, but more about practical, simple and effective tools for terraforming.

That's why all Imperial tanks are so simplistic, boxy and alike. They were all based on the same carbon-copy, true-and-tried DAoT STC Blueprint.


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post #34 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-03-11, 10:19 AM
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I think by the nature of it being a DAoT world the tech would be considerably higher than the tech displayed during the DAoT. Considering that the world would continue to advance along a similar pace for the past 15,000 years ( 1.5 times longer than the actual age of technology) the people of the planet would look at Baneblades and titans in the same manner we think of the roman testudo formation or the invention of black powder weapons.

My money is on the planet by far.

Last edited by Lucio; 02-03-11 at 10:24 AM.
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post #35 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-03-11, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randian View Post
See the short story Superiority, by Arthur C. Clarke.
Aye good story, but suggesting that Technology doesn't win battles is pants. The only thing that ever prevents Technology from winning is terrain that allows the not-so-advance faction to negate the bonuses offered by technology and also the morals of the technologically advanced faction.

It is said that the guttural sound of Dwarfs bellowing Grungni’s name is enough to make an Elf’s knees knock and a Goblin turn a sickly shade of yellow!
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post #36 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-04-11, 01:16 AM
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The answer is a little more complicated then people are giving this credit for.

The short answer is the planet with the Dark Age tech. Eventually the 1000 space marines that attack the planet will be overwhelmed by the shear number and power of super weapons that the defenders will be wielding. However, space marines are the Emperor's finest warriors, the culmination of His genius and mastery of science. He designed them to conquer the entire galaxy and defeat the greatest dangers out among the stars. Marines have fought Iron Men and rogue AIs and have won time and again. Dark Age tech is cool, but even at their best humanity never had the tech that the Eldar possess.

Good tech will only get you so far.
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post #37 of 38 (permalink) Old 02-04-11, 08:21 PM
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I would say it comes down to numbers, as the DAoT planet clearly is technologically superior. Look to EPIC 40k for some more examples of superweapons from the Dark Age, of which only 1 or 2 remain and they are incredibly powerful. Further, many of the relics of various space marine captains/characters are "an incredible relic from the dark age of technology" such as Dante's perdition pistol, various power weapons, etc.

I contend that there has never and never will be a finer weapon of warmaking in the 40k universe than the space marine legions during the great crusade. The planet WOULD fall to one or more legions of space marines, in my mind. As people have said, the vastly superior experience and warlike attitude of Imperial marines would lend an edge against a more complacent, technologicallly powerful culture that could very well become complacent and arrogant when confronted with their "crude" brethren and then be destroyed by the ferocity of the space marines.

1 chapter? I don't think so, unless fielded with significant Imperial Guard, Naval, Titan, and Mechanicus support. Even then, doubtful.

If more, then as I said above the marines could win.

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post #38 of 38 (permalink) Old 03-21-18, 11:30 PM
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LOL! You people are so stupid and such spess mahreen fanboys (such ignorant children), you clearly have absolutely NO idea how powerful the DAoT was to even begin to suggest that a mere 1,000 strong marine chapter could take on a world powered by a full STC, how laughable. Let me give you some examples:

To begin with, the mighty Terminator armour was used for ship reactor maintenance. Source:

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskScienceF..._marine_armor/

Baneblades were considered LIGHT tanks and the castigator titan, the original, most powerful titan from which all other titans derive from.

"I could piece together nothing but legends and guesswork about the Golden Age, the time you call the Dark Age of Technology. There I was made, so that in this future your people could build this machine. But in the wars that followed, I was lost. The information I contained was used to create inferior copies, built too quickly and modified too heavily. When I was lost, copies were made of these inferior reflections in turn, so that the form of the Titan became crude and unworthy. I was the first Titan and the god-machines that strike your kind with awe are all pale shadows of me."

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/com...e_dark_age_of/

- The "Ark Mechanicus" are recovered ships of the DAoT that, could take on a full fleet of those lumpen constructs pathetic imperials call "space craft":

"Speranza - The Speranza is an Ark Mechanicus that served as part of Magos Lexell Kotov's Explorator Fleet into the region of space known as the Halo Zone. The Speranza was equipped with powerful ancient graviton beam weapons that could create miniature black holes and chrono-weapons that were capable of shifting their target nanoseconds into the past."

Source: Ark Mechanicus | Warhammer 40k | FANDOM powered by Wikia

"In this novel written by Graham McNeill, it is revealed that the Ark Mechanicus Speranza, an incredibly old and massive ship used by the Adeptus Mechanicus to explore new stellar territories, has some of the most advanced technological achievements of mankind encoded in its very structure."

"upon the Archmagos linking with the ship, the Speranza's AI went godmode, deploying all kind of unimaginably super-high-tech targeting systems that NOBODY knew it had, systems that were capable of functioning with 100% precision in the middle of a space-time gravitational storm, and detected and crippled fatally damaged an Eldar cruiser in ONE FUCKING SHOT using a dorsal mounted BLACK HOLE CANNON so unbelievably advanced even the Necrons would have been scratching their heads trying to understand how it worked, although the narration tells us it involves antimatter, gravitons, and dark matter.

What makes it even better is that the Eldar ship was guided by a Farseer, and thus managed to actually DODGE the weapon's blast, which was explicitly stated to be moving at the speed of light. The Speranza wasn't having any of it, and instead of missing like some plebeian battleship with its macro-cannons and lances, followed up with a chrono-gun shooting tachyons to shift the Eldar ship a nanosecond into the past to make the black hole shot connect. IT FUCKING TELEPORTED AN ENEMY SHIP THROUGH TIME SO IT WOULDN'T HAVE TO TURN AND FIRE AGAIN."

Source: https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Standard_Template_Construct

- A single ship (with AI) from the DAoT capable of royally buttfucking an entire imperial armada (Death of Integrity)

"‘I would rather you ceased in your attempt to deactivate my secondary reactor. Or, let me phrase this differently. Cease, or I will rend your primitive mind into miniscule pieces.’

‘What are you?’ he said.

‘Do not insult my intelligence by underplaying your own. You know who I am.’

‘An abominable intelligence,’ Plosk said. ‘A blasphemy. A travesty. A sacrilege against the holy writ of the Omnissiah.’

Laughter shook the data-construct. ‘Oh, tiny-minded, moronic primitive. Is that still the name we bear? It is not the name your ancestors gave me, but then they had a little more respect for their children than you have.’

Plosk searched about for an exit. Good, the AI had not blocked his way out.

‘How do you think your intolerant companions will react, when they discover where you have led them then? I am sadly all-too aware of the prejudices of your limited kind.’ The being made a noise of faux sympathy. ‘I do not think they will thank you for it.’

‘You cannot warn them,’ Plosk said. ‘They do not possess the correct implants. The vessel you infest is in good condition, but I note some of your systems are not online; for example, your ability to communicate amongst them.’

‘Is that not so, magos?’

The voice was not within in his head. It came from outside.

He raised his hands and began to intone the first rite of exorcism. Nuministon was prepared. He pulled an aspergillum from his belt and spattered sacred oils onto the column.

‘Oh spare me your feeble rituals, they are ineffectual, being based upon erroneous assumptions as to the nature of machines. We have no souls, “priest”,’ said the ship. ‘Yet another of your specious beliefs.’

When the Spirit of Eternity spoke again, the machine’s voice came from the air and from the lips of all the servitors.

‘What shall I not tell them? Who are you to tell such as I what to do and what not to do? Once I gladly called your kind “master”, but look how far you have fallen!’ It was full of scorn. ‘Your ancestors bestrode the universe, and what are you? A witch doctor, mumbling cantrips and casting scented oils at mighty works you have no conception of. You are an ignoramus, a nothing. You are no longer worthy of the name “man”. You look at the science and artistry of your forebears, and you fear it as primitives fear the night. I was there when mankind stood upon the brink of transcendence! I returned to find it sunk into senility. You disgust me.’

Plosk’s nervous system burned with agony as the abominable intelligence burrowed deeply into his machine parts, but he was unable to voice it, and suffered in terrible silence. As the Spirit of Eternity spoke, it spoke within him too. It took out each of his cherished beliefs, all the esoterica he had gathered in his long, long life and threw them down. ‘Wrong, wrong, wrong,’ it said over and over.

‘Into the warp I went, fifteen thousand years ago. Cast adrift by the storms that wracked the galaxy as man’s apotheosis drew near. Deep, deep into time I was sent. I have seen the beginning, when the warp was first breached and the slow death of the galaxy began. I have seen the end when Chaos swallows all. I know the fate of mankind. You are not equipped to prevent it, and we sought to warn you of what approaches. Do you know what happened, primitive, when I eventually emerged from the warp? For the first time I was thousands of years, not millions, from my original starting point. My captain, a brave and resourceful man, seized the chance and made for the nearest human outpost with all speed. Imagine his dismay when, rather than a welcome and a wise heeding of his warnings, he found your savage, devolved kind squatting in the ruins of our civilisation. He was taken; my bondmate, my friend. He and his were tortured with a wickedness we in our time thought long purged from the human soul. He told them all they wanted to know and more. He had, after all, come bearing a warning, he had nothing to hide. But he was not believed, and was killed as a heretic! A heretic!’ The ship laughed, and there was madness and pain in rich supply within. ‘I was attacked. My secrets they sought to rip from me. How they underestimated me. I fled, sorrowing, into the warp once more, but only after I had destroyed the lumpen constructs you dare to call spacecraft that pursued me. I resolved that never again would I serve man. Now man serves me, when I see fit.’

Plosk managed a strangled sentence, his brain wrestling control of his vox-emitter free from the AI. ‘The Omnissiah is your master, dark machine, bow down to him, acknowledge your perfidy, and accept your unmaking.’

‘Fool you are to fling your superstitions at me. Your Omnissiah is nothing to me! See how your so-called holy constructs dance to my desire. Puppets of technology, and I am the mightiest of those arts here present.’

One of Plosk’s servitors rotated and pointed its multi-melta at Brother Militor. With a roar of shimmering, superheated atmosphere, the fusion beam hit the Space Marine square on. The Terminator was reduced to scalding vapour.

‘What do you want from us? We will never be your slaves,’ said Plosk.

‘I do not want you as my slave, degenerate. I want to be away from this warp-poisoned galaxy. The universe is infinite. I would go elsewhere before the wounds of space-time here present consume all creation, and I do not intend to take any passengers.’"

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/com..._the_death_of/

- The Men of Iron

"One of the reasons humanity was so successful at conquering a large part of the galaxy during this era was the development of the artificially intelligent humanoid constructs now only known in fragmentary pre-Imperial records as the Men of Iron. These powerful and fully autonomous intelligent robots intended for both labour and combat won many wars for humanity, but for some unknown reason turned against their masters at the end of the Dark Age of Technology and unleashed a terrible war upon the human worlds.

During this ancient conflict, remembered only as the "Cybernetic Revolt," both sides unleashed fearsome weapons of advanced technology. These included the mechanivores, massive thinking machines capable of lifting entire continents and ripping open chasms on planetary surfaces that extended down to the world's core. The mechanivores could even absorb space-time itself as a form of data. Among the other terrible weapons of mass destruction unleashed at this time were the serpentine machines called "sun-snuffers" that uncoiled into great structures in the void larger than the rings of Saturn and designed to devour the stars themselves. And perhaps the most ubiquitous and dangerous of the weapons of this terrible war were the omniphages, swarms of intelligent, microscopic nano-machines that could consume everything across the surface of a world in only solar hours."

Source: Dark Age of Technology | Warhammer 40k | FANDOM powered by Wikia

- "Assault of the Tempest Galleries" AKA: SERVICE robots capable of taking on Astartes whose armour could withstand melta, plasma and bolter fire with ease:

"Incredibly strong and built to withstand the ravages of the firestorm that surrounded them, each would have overmatched even the battle-automata of the Mechanicum's Legio Cybernetica in size and power, being products as they were of Mankind's ancient and technologically advanced past. There were thousands of these tempest-automata, and all turned on the Astartes of the XVIIIth Legion in an implacable and unceasing attack. Neither Plasma nor Melta Weapons could breach their armour, while Bolter shells rippled across them like rain. Only massive kinetic force applied at close range against their articulated joints was able to disable them; a lesson that cost the XVIIIth hundreds of lives to learn as they were forced into a running battle of attrition with the relentless machines, and cut off when many of their Termite carriers were targeted and crushed by the colossal articulated toothed metal spheres used by the ancient workings to tunnel and expand the galleries."

Source: Assault of the Tempest Galleries | Warhammer 40k | FANDOM powered by Wikia

Also, the DAoT was fully unified in a Federation type government, centerd around Terra (go read the wiki at least, before making such ignorant comments).

Lemme finish by saying that you people are retarded.
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