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post #41 of 47 (permalink) Old 04-15-14, 06:44 AM
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Cain novels shows this as well.
Would that happen to be the latest Cain novel; the one involving the Tau? I have yet ot read it but I am interested to see how it plays out. I don't remember reading of it in Warriors of Ultrmar, but I will double check as it has been some time since I read the book.

In any case I just cannot see the Nids leaving anything other than rocks and earth behind. They have consumed quite a few opponents and created quite a few special creatures to adapt to the ever-chaning battlefield.

For example the "Doom of Malan'tai" from HF Medusa, a Zoan that was adapted to extreme proportions and even was noted for having gorwn a natural "Hood," to help it feed on the souls of it's prey. this was probably from the high number of Imperial psyker the Hive Mind ingested and put to good use. "Old One Eye" from HF Behemoth that is siad to continue to ravange Calth to this very day. It's ability to regenerate itself even after having taken mortal wounds is something that is akin to a Space Marines ability to regenerate from taking normal wounds that would kill any normal human. Perhaps the "Red Terror" perhaps, which was adapted to fight in the tunnels of the mining world of Delvan. I'm sure the Hive Mind had to absorb some minerals, or mining equiptment, and deduced that sucha creature would make the perfect killing machine.

Just saying, I cannot see the Nid leaving anything of Biomass, or genetic value on a planet. But I suppose I'll end this here as it's more my perspective at this point less of an actual debate.



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post #42 of 47 (permalink) Old 04-15-14, 07:25 AM
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For example the "Doom of Malan'tai" from HF Medusa, a Zoan that was adapted to extreme proportions and even was noted for having gorwn a natural "Hood," to help it feed on the souls of it's prey. this was probably from the high number of Imperial psyker the Hive Mind ingested and put to good use.
Yeah...

The Doom of Malan'tai was part of hive fleet Naga, not Medusa, and it became so powerful (and got its name) by absorbing souls from Malan'tai's infinity circuit. This led to it becoming so powerful that the Eldar could do nothing to stop it.

Zoanthropes in general are created from Eldar DNA, due to their high psychic ability.

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post #43 of 47 (permalink) Old 04-15-14, 08:51 AM
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Just saying, I cannot see the Nid leaving anything of Biomass, or genetic value on a planet. But I suppose I'll end this here as it's more my perspective at this point less of an actual debate.
Well, that's because they don't. Metals, "living" or otherwise have no genetic value and are not biomass. Therefore they have no worth to the tyranids, who will simply leave it behind along with all other inorganic matter they cannot use.


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post #44 of 47 (permalink) Old 04-16-14, 08:54 PM
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The Doom of Malan'tai was part of hive fleet Naga, not Medusa, and it became so powerful (and got its name) by absorbing souls from Malan'tai's infinity circuit
I'm sorry Naga, I mismatched there. I stand corrected.



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post #45 of 47 (permalink) Old 04-18-14, 03:46 AM
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A soul is described in the context of 40k as psychic or emotional energy. Wecan be pretty confident that tyranids do not experience emotions as humans would understand, the the lore concerning the Hive Mind makes it apparent that individual creatures have little if no bearing on the state of the Hive Mind itself, which is the repository of all tyranid consciousness after all.

It stands to reason that no individual tyranid has the sort of energy to give that a Chaos God wants. Only if you could attack the Hive Mind directly would you be on the right track.



Actually, I'm not taking it literally at all. It's all about the emotions involved moreso than the act, because that is what the daemons require to draw strength. The daemons are able to feed off the energy of those they slay, it's what makes them one of the most feared forces in the galaxy. Mortal followers likewise provide this energy by their deeds, due to the emotions the feel during the acts they commit.

Daemons require energy to act, and they expend it during the act, the opposite of the above effect. For a daemon incursion to sustain itself, it requires mortal victims with souls, ie: emotions, for them to feed off.

If the tyranids have no individual emotions, no fear on which to feed, then it wouldn't matter whether they have blood or ichor, skulls or carapace. There is simply no energy for the daemons to feed off, and as such it is a losing battle for Chaos.

If this was set in the Eye of Terror or some other warp heavy area, the daemons would have near limitless energy to draw from and the advantage would easily be theirs.
According to your logic though, Genestealers have souls. They feel, think, and can actively work independent of the Hive Mind. A few other Nids can do this as well I IIRC.
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post #46 of 47 (permalink) Old 04-18-14, 04:23 AM
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According to your logic though, Genestealers have souls. They feel, think, and can actively work independent of the Hive Mind. A few other Nids can do this as well I IIRC.
Genestealers yes, however this is in no part influenced by the presence of alien dna within their own makeup. Also contributing is the fact that they are engineered to fear and flee from the tyranid fleets and are given autonomy. This is lost however once the tyranids, and thus the Hive Mind, reaches proximity.

Other vanguard tyranids however, such as lictors and gaunt variants do not share these traits. They operate via instinct, not emotion.

So it's possible that genestealers can be said to have souls, even if only temporarily. I would still call no on any other sort of tyranid though.


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post #47 of 47 (permalink) Old 04-18-14, 04:58 AM
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Genestealers yes, however this is in no part influenced by the presence of alien dna within their own makeup. Also contributing is the fact that they are engineered to fear and flee from the tyranid fleets and are given autonomy. This is lost however once the tyranids, and thus the Hive Mind, reaches proximity.

Other vanguard tyranids however, such as lictors and gaunt variants do not share these traits. They operate via instinct, not emotion.

So it's possible that genestealers can be said to have souls, even if only temporarily. I would still call no on any other sort of tyranid though.
Fair enough.
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