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post #41 of 59 (permalink) Old 11-18-13, 08:31 PM
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Well I regard all chaos worshiping and following humans/astartes as humanity or at least its legacy, being on the other side of the fence, a future for mankind under the yoke of chaos (I am not sure but this is prob what abaddon wants for mankind) is a fair possibility for mankind, I liked the idea that the other side of the fence is equally fckd. It is not because Abaddon is non-human anymore that all chaos worshippers have no human affiliation anymore, a lot of NL for example are very close to the original astartes template,


I have not read those books to be honest, and the IOM indeed triumphs often wins but often a pireas victory where again and again they lose ground. Give me an example of a IOM victory with the same gravity as what honsou did with the gene-seed storage, Talos did with the Astropaths, Honsou at ultramer, Abaddon with the GK, the only I can think of now are the destruction of the dies irea (or somethin like that), or Alaric, the former I do not regard nearly as significant, the later not so sure how to position Ben his GK nowadays,

, Again, I do not mind the IOM is going down, it is like seeing a boxing match, I just want to see a cool fight, not what is suggested in the recent lore, I want it to be undecided until the 10 th round.
Have you read the ultramarine series? That goes along with the iron warrior series?

Two ultramarines destroy honsou's fortress, wipe out most of what he was building and is pretty much stated that honsou loses a massive portion of his army.

Should I also go into detail about the banishing of angron, the loss of that warp device in the cain series or a host of other things?
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post #42 of 59 (permalink) Old 11-18-13, 08:33 PM
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, Again, I do not mind the IOM is going down, it is like seeing a boxing match, I just want to see a cool fight, not what is suggested in the recent lore, I want it to be undecided until the 10 th round.
Chaos struck the first blow over 10,000 years ago! The Imperium, against all the odds, has endured for 10,000 years! If that doesn't correlate to lasting 10 rounds in your boxing analogy I don't know what would.



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post #43 of 59 (permalink) Old 11-18-13, 09:01 PM
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Have you read the ultramarine series? That goes along with the iron warrior series?

Two ultramarines destroy honsou's fortress, wipe out most of what he was building and is pretty much stated that honsou loses a massive portion of his army.

Should I also go into detail about the banishing of angron, the loss of that warp device in the cain series or a host of other things?
I red those books and to be honest the IW did it mainly to themselves at least the warsmiths (re-introduced in angel exterminatus) did, I would not overestimate the contribution of Uriel and his posse.
Another example is the BL fight in the first ADB NL books, there also an example of how chaos inflicted a defeat upon themselves,

The banishing of Angron (you forget Magnus and the candle in the eye accident), I think you pass the point that there are still former primarchs active on the chaos side (Angron, Magnus and Mortarion (small reference in Pandorax), do not know about Alpharius and Omegon), taking the fight to the IOM, the last time a loyalist primarch did this was ...Dorn and he got blown to bits.
I can't recall how many GK got killed in the banishing, but a significant amount

@ COTE: I do not pressume to have the same knowledge over the entire 30k- 40k as you have, but absorbing punches would be the most appropriate description,

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post #44 of 59 (permalink) Old 11-18-13, 09:09 PM
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I red those books and to be honest the IW did it mainly to themselves at least the warsmiths (re-introduced in angel exterminatus) did, I would not overestimate the contribution of Uriel and his posse.
Another example is the BL fight in the first ADB NL books, there also an example of how chaos inflicted a defeat upon themselves,

The banishing of Angron (you forget Magnus and the candle in the eye accident), I think you pass the point that there are still former primarchs active on the chaos side (Angron, Magnus and Mortarion (small reference in Pandorax), do not know about Alpharius and Omegon), taking the fight to the IOM, the last time a loyalist primarch did this was ...Dorn and he got blown to bits.
I can't recall how many GK got killed in the banishing, but a significant amount

@ COTE: I do pressume to have the same knowledge over the entire 30k- 40k as you have, but absorbing punches would be the most appropriate description,
Keep in mind that only magnus and angron were the only ones to actively do things.
Roughly 95 grey knights were killed to banish angron. Keep in mind that they could only get 100 at such a short notice. If they would have had more things would have been different.
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post #45 of 59 (permalink) Old 11-21-13, 10:53 AM
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Call me the optimist but I see a light at the end of the Grimdark tunnel. Things always seem the darkest before the dawn after all. From the start of the game, when I first laid eyes on the cover of Rogue Trader, I saw a desperate stand were at least one marine lived to tell the tale. Yeh, is was sad that most would die but survival can be a victory. Take Isstvan III. Most I think would say that Horus won this war. I think it was a Loyalist victory, because I think Horus needed to kill all of the loyalists to win. The fact that the Loyalists drug the war out for as long as they did was good enough but to have survivors that make it back to Terra to tell the story and give up inter legion secrets is just icing. To take this topic back to the OP I think the Grey Knights are the spark that could light the new dawn. But that's probably just me being a Loken, Fan boy, optimist.
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post #46 of 59 (permalink) Old 11-22-13, 03:09 AM
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Call me the optimist but I see a light at the end of the Grimdark tunnel. Things always seem the darkest before the dawn after all. From the start of the game, when I first laid eyes on the cover of Rogue Trader, I saw a desperate stand were at least one marine lived to tell the tale. Yeh, is was sad that most would die but survival can be a victory. Take Isstvan III. Most I think would say that Horus won this war. I think it was a Loyalist victory, because I think Horus needed to kill all of the loyalists to win. The fact that the Loyalists drug the war out for as long as they did was good enough but to have survivors that make it back to Terra to tell the story and give up inter legion secrets is just icing. To take this topic back to the OP I think the Grey Knights are the spark that could light the new dawn. But that's probably just me being a Loken, Fan boy, optimist.
For who? The billions they kill just to hide their existence and the existence of daemons?

They aren't the white knights in shining armor. They are knights treading a fine line. Between evil and good.
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post #47 of 59 (permalink) Old 12-28-13, 06:57 PM
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Actually you can't argue that. How would Abaddon even know that Loken was a part of that group if he believes Loken died at Istvaan? I think he met Loken again, and what followed is obvious.
Or maybe he wasn't referring to Loken but another Luna Wolf who also went on to become a member of the Grey Knights.
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post #48 of 59 (permalink) Old 12-30-13, 06:03 PM
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Yes...Horus
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post #49 of 59 (permalink) Old 12-30-13, 06:05 PM Thread Starter
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Yes...Horus
Well Iacton Quruze is a known member of the Knights errant. And theres Severian from the Outcast Dead whom also where nabbed by them.
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post #50 of 59 (permalink) Old 12-30-13, 08:54 PM
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Yes however in particular I am stating that one of the most prominent of the founding grey knights members was Horus.
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