The Emperor

[xu-]

So, is the Emperor of Mankind actually divine being, or is it a lie spread by the Ecchleisarchy in order to unify Humanity and by extension keep themselves in power? or is it some mix of the two ideas? I don't think its been officially stated that the Emperor is actually a god now (even though his power might be seen as godlike by the people who worship him) - it seems to just be the common opinion of humanity. I think its just as likely that the Emperor is just an immensely powerful psyker who influences events through his own psychic ability (like the Acts of Faith the Sisters can perform, for example). What do you think?

[Reign of chaos]

I put a mix of the two, cause is he was a god.... how did Horus manage to (almost) kill him...
Plus he just doesn't seem that godly to me... Personally.

[HOBO]

A mix of the 2....a Human who's revered by other Humans as a God.

[bakoren]

False God!!!

[dtq]

I am of the mind that he is far more a god than an Emperor at the moment. He certainly isnt just a human psyker, looking at his origins as a combination of thousands of human psyker souls in one body, his "immortal" nature. The fact that the souls he was made of had reincarnating abilities as well, he's far more than "human" by any definition. He is functionally immortal.


You really need to define "God" for this purpose. Ominpotent, Monotheistic Supreme Creator he certainly isnt. He is not a natural creator of existence... Not even the creator of Humanity. But he easily stacks up to the power attributed to greek gods etc, hence quite easy to define as "A god". To me it seems the emperor has at least as much omipresence and ability to carry out specific acts as any of the big four chaos gods - who also rather than creating their domains and the acts associated with them were instead created by these things which predated the gods. The eldar were hedonists before slaanesh came to be, slaanesh is not the creator of the pursuit of pleasure. Slaanesh is not a natural ruler or creator of the universe but is accepted as a "god" I see no reason why the Emperor can not be just as much a god, especially given the constant strengthening he receives from the golden throne. Im also quite convinced that the Emperors warp power is fed by the worship of humanity across the galaxy, just as much as the chaos gods receive strength from acts associated with them and from worship.

Perhaps if there are four gods of chaos, perhaps the emperor is the god of "order". Remembering the Warp is not actually chaotic by nature! It is not by nature a realm of evil, it is not in origin a realm to be feared at all by humanity. The biggest precipitating factor in the decision of the shamans creating the emperor was that the warp was become more chaotic instead of peacefull and tranquel as it had been. If "negative" forces can coalesce in the warp to create a warp power, why cant "positive" power also feed a warp presence such as the emperors, ascending him to the same status as the 4 gods of chaos, and the variou other warp gods of other species, all just as much created rather than creators.


The Emperor seems to have little direct rule over humanity, little to do with everyday decisions, Not much of a ruler at all, high lords of terra rule humanity. I dont see the emperor being less in power or warp presence than the chaos gods. There is plenty of fiction around to suggest he does have some ability to react to fervent followers or to overall hazards to mankind.


In 40k gods can perish or be harmed looking at what happened to the Eldar's Pantheon at slaanesh's birth. I dont therefore see the emperors wounds (to his physical shell) as being proof of his none godhood. After all Khaine gets his body shattered on regular basis, without destroying his warp presence. Just as Im 100% convinced that the death of the emperors body would not be the end of the Emperor at all.

[Winterous]

Damn good post DTQ, +rep! (teehee, I took it up to 69 XD)

Anyway, I voted human, but after reading that I change it to a true deity.
Keeping in mind, in this context 'god' doesn't mean God or Allah or whatever, they aren't the ultimate law and creator, they are just a supremely powerful consciousness.

Excepting the Emperor, there are 3 types of gods in the 40k universe.

Chaos gods, which are psychic entities by very definition, they are a being placed wholly in the warp, they cannot directly influence the material plane.

C'tan, they are beings of the physical plane, but they have no true physical form; in a way, they are a warp entity in the physical plane, but have no connection to the warp; they cannot influence the warp AT ALL, but can manipulate physics at will.

The Eldar gods, I don't know much about them, but I know that they have both a physical and warp presence, meaning they were the only true omnipotent gods, as they are the only ones who are of the warp and of the physical plane.

Then there's the Emperor, he is a living organism, and yes, just a very powerful psyker.
But as DTQ said, he's much more than that, he doesn't just use the power of the warp to manipulate the real world like most psykers do, he has a powerful influence over the warp itself.
He can fight the Chaos gods like the Eldar gods can, meaning he does have direct influence over the warp.
He can guide his followers through the warp, meaning that he can MAP the warp, guiding people through the ebb and flow safely, and in the right direction.
And just the same, he (used to) can directly influence the physical world, as his real existence is that of a physical body.


I'd say the Emperor is not quite as much of a god as the Eldar gods, but he is comparably powerful.
He doesn't have a body in both the warp and real world, but he has comparable influence over both to the Eldar gods.

[Inquisitor Einar]

I've voted a mix of the two. Because I think that he's not quite there in the process of BECOMING a full fledged god. He is still linked to his 'earthly presence' in the corpse on the throne, hence no a full god ( yet ).

Otherwise, with all of humanity worshipping him, and his own psychic origins with the shamans, he's by my book a full fledged god like the chaos gods are ( and the c'than ).

DTQ summed up nicely what I think of him.

[Sethis]

I would call him the only human to ever have reached the apex of humanities potential, in both mind and body.

[Boganius Maximal]

I voted a mix of the two but after reading the previous statements in this thread I feel my reasons are simplistic and childish compared to those above and also they have basically explained what I think of the topic in a much more learned way than I ever could(especially dtq and winterous)

[shaantitus]

There is very little i can add to this thread except for the following.

What dtq said makes a hell of a lot of sense.

and

How do you define human and god.
Could it not be that as psychic powers become more powerful you move along a scale from human to god. A God in this case is a human with almost unlimited psychic powers.