Boyz before Toyz (Simple mistake in writing ork lists) - Page 3 - Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #21 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-14-10, 11:58 PM
Senior Member
 
Crimzzen's Avatar
Crimzzen's Flag is: Canada
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,681
Reputation: 3


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfCheese View Post
Boyz can generally do everything that Nobz can.
Boyz can take on almost anything in combat, and win.
A unit of Nobz is slightly better if you want to take on MC's and stuff, but considering a squad of Nobz is over 3 times the price, id rather 3 squads of Boyz.
Leave the MC killing to Lootas, and finish off the last couple of wounds with Boyz if you want.
I disagree. A nob biker has nearly infinite (Ok maybe not that many) uses over a regular boy. The biggest I can think of are wound allocation, T5, FNP, 24" of movement /w a 3+ cover save, multitude of wargear options.

Sadly, in the days of space wolves, blood angels, and imperial guard, the humble boy isn't what he use to be. Granted, they are still good model for their point cost, they don't compare to the above for their point cost.

I generally don't disembark my boyz anymore - they sit in their battlewagon doing drive-bys and ramming things. Generally, they can't stand up to some of the newer marines or the torrent of firepower put out by guard.

This is where my nob bikers come in. They are still my old reliable killing unit. Able to multi-assault and win - finally turbo-boosting onto an objective at the end of the game (who doesn't make these guys scoring?!). As long as the wound allocation rule existings, these guys will always be a rock solid unit in which arguably no points are wasted.

Allouttabubblegum? - 40K Blog - contains batreps, tactics, and all my work including past and present! Sign up today!
Crimzzen is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #22 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-15-10, 12:33 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
Tossy's Flag is: Australia
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 221
Reputation: 1
Default

This is my fault. When I moved this from my computer on HO I didn't I was not talking about nob bikers or meganobz. The nobz I was talking about was nobz on foot or in a trukk or wagon. It appears I used an old version of my file. It was meant to say "This does not include biker nobz" and under meganobz it had "meganobz like biker nobz have their place"..

bah, fixed. Thanks for pointing that out.

But my point remains valid. Nobz are crap compared to boyz, and are the same price. They can do nothing boyz can't and honestly I'd rather take grots

Last edited by Tossy; 09-15-10 at 12:53 AM.
Tossy is offline  
post #23 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-15-10, 04:54 AM
Moderator
 
KingOfCheese's Avatar
KingOfCheese's Flag is: Australia
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South Australia
Posts: 4,525
Reputation: 1


Default

Painboyz can have bikes.

Nob Bikers are the ONLY way to run normal Nobz.
If Nobz dont have bikes, then their job is better left to Boyz or Meganobz.


KingOfCheese is offline  
 
post #24 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-27-10, 07:59 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 25
Reputation: 1
Default

So I'm fairly new player but I have been reading a bit and playing on my spare time. I often see the comment here that Boyz can do everything Nobz can. I don't find this to be the case at all, pretty much ever.

I normally have a 7nob squad, PKs Painboyz, cyborgs, armour etc..That squad with a WB is a beast squad and stands toe to toe with most other beefy squads it has faced including Thunder Wolf Calv.

Also considering that in most of the games I've played I'm facing normally 2 LR's if not 3. In which case 1 nob with a PK in a 20/30 boy squad has a pretty low chance of penning AV14.

In terms of the Meganobz yes they are +2 unless they are Vs. PW which everyone has of course, in which case...ooops their dead.

Bikers I haven't experimented with yet, I have been somewhat avoiding it since it seems to be an Ork I WIN staple but I do want to try them.

So since I'm knew I'm thinking that possibly I'm misunderstanding how....

30Boyz + Nob PK = 3PK's, FNP, +4 Armour, +5Invuln at WS 5 (w/banner) ? Obviously it's a point issue but the nobz will toe to toe and destroy many things the Boyz can't.
Graith is offline  
post #25 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-28-10, 04:08 AM
Senior Member
 
Wolf_Lord_Skoll's Avatar
Wolf_Lord_Skoll's Flag is: Australia
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 4,505
Reputation: 1


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graith View Post
So I'm fairly new player but I have been reading a bit and playing on my spare time. I often see the comment here that Boyz can do everything Nobz can. I don't find this to be the case at all, pretty much ever.

I normally have a 7nob squad, PKs Painboyz, cyborgs, armour etc..That squad with a WB is a beast squad and stands toe to toe with most other beefy squads it has faced including Thunder Wolf Calv.
But how many points is this unit worth? How well does it fair against Hammernators?

Also considering that in most of the games I've played I'm facing normally 2 LR's if not 3. In which case 1 nob with a PK in a 20/30 boy squad has a pretty low chance of penning AV14.
How many points are we talking here? At 3000 points and so on, some units are effective that never would be in more 'normal' games of 1500-2000

In terms of the Meganobz yes they are +2 unless they are Vs. PW which everyone has of course, in which case...ooops their dead.
But said PW kill normal Nobz just as fast.

Bikers I haven't experimented with yet, I have been somewhat avoiding it since it seems to be an Ork I WIN staple but I do want to try them.
There is no such thing as an "I WIN" button. Nob Bikers have many weaknesses that balance them, but they are better than normal Nobz thanks to speed and such IMO.

30Boyz + Nob PK = 3PK's, FNP, +4 Armour, +5Invuln at WS 5 (w/banner) ? Obviously it's a point issue but the nobz will toe to toe and destroy many things the Boyz can't.
The biggest thing is, yes Nobz are powerful. But they are relatively fragile for their price. A single Nob with Power Claw can take a few Nob buddies or a TON of Boyz to be his meatshield. In 1500-2000 point games, The cheaper Boyz w/ Nobz option cuts less into your points, allowing you to bring things like Burna's, Lotta's, Trukk's and so on.

Then there is always the volume of attacks to consider. Sure, Boyz can't dish out S8 PW hits, but they can dish out many more S4 attacks per point than any Nob ever could. This can force many failed saves and chew through things like Marines well enough. Likewise, Nobz can fall down to a huge number of attacks like Boyz can, but Boyz are less effected by high power shots (ie Plas/Melta ect.)

Remember that if you wipe out your opponents unit in their turn, your unit is stuck in the open for their shooting phase. The optimal time to take destroying an enemy unit in combat is often two phases. Start during yours, locked during their shooting phase, then finish them off in their combat phase, ready to move again in your turn.

So in summary, Boyz are cheaper, less effected by high powered shots and can dish out a high volume of attacks. Nobz have their place, but it is most effective when they are either Nob Bikers (High speed and resilience) or Meganobz (High resilence and better point efficiency).
Wolf_Lord_Skoll is offline  
post #26 of 30 (permalink) Old 09-28-10, 05:52 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 25
Reputation: 1
Default

Most of the games I play are in the 1750-2k range, and while I understand the usefulness of boyz squads I'm not sold changing out my nobz for more boyz. This probably also has a lot to do with my limited experience and the people that I am playing normally.
Graith is offline  
post #27 of 30 (permalink) Old 03-19-11, 04:46 PM
Member
 
BobbyDaBlue's Avatar
BobbyDaBlue's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 30
Reputation: 1
Default

Its sad but true Nobs are to expensive to make worth while but I love me some Mega Armor Nobs!
BobbyDaBlue is offline  
post #28 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-03-16, 01:41 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 1
Reputation: 1
Default Hey

I'm a complete noob and want to start playing with my friends, who are already veteran player. I simply LOVE the orks and am very thankful for your hints. Could you help me with my 1000pt. army? Do you think that I should go with transports? And how many boyz would you recommend?
JBeier is offline  
post #29 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-03-16, 02:52 PM
Senior Member
 
ntaw's Avatar
ntaw's Flag is: Canada
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Mississauga, Canada
Posts: 6,082
Reputation: 94


Default

Last post here is from 5 years ago so I'm not sure how much help will come your way, but if you post up with what you have in the Ork army list section I'm sure someone will be able to help
ntaw is offline  
post #30 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-06-16, 04:34 AM
Spored to be Wild
 
morfangdakka's Avatar
morfangdakka's Flag is: USA
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 4,387
Reputation: 30


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JBeier View Post
I'm a complete noob and want to start playing with my friends, who are already veteran player. I simply LOVE the orks and am very thankful for your hints. Could you help me with my 1000pt. army? Do you think that I should go with transports? And how many boyz would you recommend?
We can help you with a list write one up and post it in the army list section. Also you might want to read more recent tactical articles because now days it is toys before boyz with orks but we can talk about that later.


Red Orc
"Ahh, isn't Morfang sweet, like a great big 350-pound (that's 25 stone, UK users!) ball of cuddly death...?"


God, gives children to people so that death won't seem so disappointing.
morfangdakka is offline  
Reply

  Lower Navigation
Go Back   Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums > Warhammer 40K > Tactica Articles > Ork Tactics Articles

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wargaming Forum and Wargamer Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome