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post #11 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-23-10, 10:50 PM
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I'm sorry but i they are not the greatest chapter. They did not single handily beat back all the traitors at the end of the Heresy. Being paragons of the Codex Astartes doesnt make them amazing. Diversity is needed, The first and second wars for armageddon were won in part due to the Space Wolfs and Blood Angels unorthodox tactics and methods. The Black Templars are arguably one of the largest chapters along with the Space Wolfs and if they all came together as one would be an unrivaled force. The Grey Knights are without a doubt the most steadfast chapter, not a single one having fallen to chaos, more individually powerful then any other chapters marines. Or if your going to use they "they saved the Imperium after the Heresy route" then by that logic i would argue that the Blood Angels, Imperial Fists and White Scars are the greatest chapters as without them their wouldnt have even been a Seige of Terra, it would have been a massacre. Or again the Dark Angels and Space Wolfs are the greatest as they broke the Siege

Yes the Ultramarines are good, they have to be because they are GW poster boys, every new edition slaps some amazing new fluff onto them. But they are no means the greatest, none of them are
The 2nd War for Armageddon was finally won by the Blood Angels, Salamander and...Ultramarines- the BA couldn't have won on their own.

It was the Space Wolves, Dark Angels and...Ultramarines who broke the Siege of Terra, it was the UM who saved Rogal Dorn and the Imperial Fists from being destroyed by the Iron Warriors.

They are diverse, the Codex is an incredibly large tome that has views and advice on virtually every scenario- remember being divergent doesn't make you diverse it just means you've chosen a narrow path that doesn't follow the main stream.

Oh and after the Heresy they did the do the majority of beating back the traitors and keeping the Imperium of Man unified.

I can't think of any single Chapter that's done more for the Imperium than the Ultramarines, with that definition they'd certainly be classed as the Greatest Chapter.
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post #12 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-23-10, 10:53 PM
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I agree the Ultramarines are good but not the greatest i mean really any true fan knows this
I'm sorry but what? Does that mean because I acknowledge the regularly witnessed hatred of Ultramarines as completely unwarranted and foolish that I am not a true fan?

Sorry, but that statement of yours alone nearly takes the cake for dumb things I have seen or read today.

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post #13 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-23-10, 11:04 PM
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Sure im no fan of the smurfs, im not saying their not good, i do despise the amount of praise and flawlessness GW bestow upon them. But i still think its not accurate to call them the greatest chapter. Yes their may have been Ultramarines on Armageddon, but it was clearly a Blood Angel orchestrated affair. Dante was given unanimous command and it was through his tactics that the campaign was won, the Ultramarines did what he told them to do. Im not saying this makes the Blood Angels the greatest, im just pointing out that the Codex isnt always the answer.

And it has(fucking annoyingly) only been in some recent fluff that the Ultras break the siege aswell, originally they were no where near Terra, exactly as Horus intended, but madeningly GW have decided they need a little more praise and replaced the DA with them. The Ultramrines have had the most limelight yes, but who knows what other outstanding and similar feats the other Chapters have done.

Again i realise what the Ultramrines have contributed, but i still dont believe they or any chapter are the greatest, and thats not my anger at the Ultramarines speaking on that, its my genuine unbiased opinion
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post #14 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-24-10, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Angel of Blood View Post
Sure im no fan of the smurfs, im not saying their not good, i do despise the amount of praise and flawlessness GW bestow upon them. But i still think its not accurate to call them the greatest chapter. Yes their may have been Ultramarines on Armageddon, but it was clearly a Blood Angel orchestrated affair. Dante was given unanimous command and it was through his tactics that the campaign was won, the Ultramarines did what he told them to do. Im not saying this makes the Blood Angels the greatest, im just pointing out that the Codex isnt always the answer.

And it has(fucking annoyingly) only been in some recent fluff that the Ultras break the siege aswell, originally they were no where near Terra, exactly as Horus intended, but madeningly GW have decided they need a little more praise and replaced the DA with them. The Ultramrines have had the most limelight yes, but who knows what other outstanding and similar feats the other Chapters have done.

Again i realise what the Ultramrines have contributed, but i still dont believe they or any chapter are the greatest, and thats not my anger at the Ultramarines speaking on that, its my genuine unbiased opinion
Well of course Calgar would defer to Dante- he's been a Chapter Master 3-4x longer, his wealth of experience is unprecedented amongst the Masters of the Astartes. Just like the majority of Astartes put themselves under the command of Grimnar during the 13th Black Crusade as he was the most experienced Chapter Master and the same circumstances occur on the Eastern Fringe with Calgar.

You're mistaken- the Ultramarines were always far away from Terra when the Siege began but it's also been the case for years that the Ultramarines were one of the Legions to break the siege, they haven't replaced the Dark Angels so I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion- the UM arrived shortly after the SW and DA.

I certainly don't think other Chapters haven't perfromed extraordinary feats I just don't think any other single chapter has done as much as the Ultramarines.

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post #15 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-24-10, 12:54 AM
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No in the older stories of the Seige of the Emperors palace. In particular the one with loads of detail of the battle it specifically states Dark Angels and Space Wolfs as being mere hours away, the Ultramarines are not even mentioned, and were always said to have finally arrived after the battle was won and long over. But in the recent fluff its now the Space Wolfs and Ultramarines who are mere hours away with the Dark Angels a little longer.
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post #16 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-24-10, 01:17 AM
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No in the older stories of the Seige of the Emperors palace. In particular the one with loads of detail of the battle it specifically states Dark Angels and Space Wolfs as being mere hours away, the Ultramarines are not even mentioned, and were always said to have finally arrived after the battle was won and long over. But in the recent fluff its now the Space Wolfs and Ultramarines who are mere hours away with the Dark Angels a little longer.
Wow have you got some stuff GW haven't released to the rest of us yet? Because in the Horus Heresy: Collected Visions it doesn't mention that the Space Wolves and Ultramarines were closer with the Dark Angels further behind.

Really all 3 Legions arrived after the Siege ended, it was their imminent arrival that pretty much broke the Siege.

Please reference which source material states that the Space Wolves and Dark Angels as being mere hours away but doesn't mention the Ultramarines at all- becuase again I think you're mistaken.
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post #17 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-24-10, 07:45 AM
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Are we really arguing and bitching about made up space men?

Here's a question.

Why do you care?

That's the worrying thing here. Its a story written by shit authors.
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post #18 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-24-10, 08:55 AM
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"First Chaplain Erebus broke the news to Horus: the Ultramarines and Space Wolves Legions were nearing Terra; and only a short distance behind were the Dark Angels"

That's the more recent telling. Now i've got to go sift through virtually all the Index Astartes, Chapter Aproved and White Dwarfs to find the other story. Can't tell me no one else remembers it? it was epic, mentioned alot more than the visions entry, including the Defenders who turned traitor at the very beggning of the siege, the fate of some of the diffferent Titan legions, like one of the Traitor ones which landed in a tar pit or something and sunk, the ever strange one of Phalanx trying to get Khan back to the palace but crashing into the middle of the traitor army and killing hundreds of thousands of them. No? want to find it again just to read it
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post #19 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-24-10, 09:00 AM
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Actually you know what, PM me this source you've got (which you've still yet to reveal) so we can stop being off-topic with this thread.

Last edited by Baron Spikey; 08-24-10 at 09:20 AM.
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post #20 of 25 (permalink) Old 08-24-10, 10:37 AM
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Sorry, but going back on topic!

The trailer is by no means the greatest thing ever to grace humanity, but what do you expect? This is a gaming company trying to break into the motion-picture industry. Their funds are much more limited than, say, Pixar, but that is the purpose of this first movie. GW are trying to widen their fan base, and although it may be along the lines of Transformers 2 in terms of 'storyline quality,' if it gets more people interested in the hobby then bring it the hell on!

I'll buy it out of principle, and hope that at least this movie is successful enough to enable future endeavors.


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