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post #1 of 4 (permalink) Old 01-10-17, 10:10 AM Thread Starter
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Default Competitive 1850 Chaos List?

Hi folks,

I've made a rough design for a list that I think would do rather well, but I wanted to get feedback from others and see if I'm missing anything!

Renegades and Heretics (The Purge)

HQ

Command Squad (85p)
- Ordnance Tyrant (Warlord)
- Covenant of Nurgle
- 4 x Disciples

Troops

10 x Plague Zombies (30p)
10 x Plague Zombies (30p)

Heavy Support (Wyverns and Griffons are also Compulsory Elites)

2 x Wyvern (110p)
- Chemical Flamers
2 x Griffon (70p)
- Chemical Flamers
3 x Renegade Rapier Laser Destroyer (79p)
- Militia Training
- Extra Crew
1 x Leman Russ Exterminator (150p)
- Militia Training
- Sponson Multi-meltas

Chaos Space Marines (Iron Warriors CAD)

HQ

1 x Sorcerer (60p)
-VoTLW

Troops

10 x Cultists (50p)
1 x Obliterator (70p)
- VoTLW

Heavy Support

1 x Deimos Pattern Predator (145p)
- Plasma Destroyer
- Lascannon Sponsons
5 x Havocs (115p)
- 4 x Autocannon
- VoTLW

Lord of War

1 x Typhon Heavy Siege Tank (390p)
- Lascannon Sponsons

Forgehost (Chaos Daemons Formation)

3 x Soul Grinders (465p)
- 3 x Baleful Torrent
- Daemon of Khorne

Clocks in at 1849 points!
This gives 51 infantry models - with pretty reliable leadership. And 10 vehicles - 5 of which are notoriously f***ing tough!
So the tactic would be to have a standard gun line of artillery and havocs (which could realistically cripple an opponent in one turn), with fearless zombies and cultists (not fearless) helping to hold objectives. And then to put forward pressure on the opponent with the three soul grinders, the typhon, the russ and the predator. All of which can also stay back to defend against alpha strike armies. The soul grinders having easy access to twin-linking via their formation benefit, along with skyfire will allow me to effectively deal with flyers. The havocs and oblit also have tank hunter to help give that extra bite!

What would you consider the main weaknesses of this list to be?

Cheers!

Last edited by Lancelot185; 01-10-17 at 10:39 AM.
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post #2 of 4 (permalink) Old 01-10-17, 11:18 AM
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Hey lancelot, welcome to the board.
the list is fine to me, its totally playable and should wreck some faces with all that firepower.
However, you asked if that list was good for competitive, whic i assume means tournaments...so my answer is no, here's why:
(mind you, i keep myself a mile away from tourney scene, since i despise that with all my heart, so take my opinion with lot of salt...there are more qualified people that can help you!)

-forgeworld model (not all tourney allow that, check this out first)

-the exterminator loadout is meh...not reliably performing. i'd never mix shortrange melta with long range autocannons.

-extremely low bodycount, squishy models (20 zombies are not so impressive, 10 cultists will die to a handwave, 1 obliterator is negligible, 1 naked sorceror is a token, 5 havocs are just 5 marines) you will remain soon with vehicles alone

-due to above, you have 0 capability to bubblewrap your precious vehicles and protect them from grav-melta-assault. your vehicle gunline is going to have an hard time trying to survive

-you have only 3 vehicles with av 14 (front) with the rest being av12 (imperial artillery) and 13 (grinders on the front) wich means they will not withstand even autocannon fire. due to above, they will be outmanouvred and assaulted/shot to pieces (remember, eldar jetbikes with mass str6 fire is a common thing and 3/4 of your mech will fall to that if shot on the back)

-it will be hard to contest objectives due to lack of speed, manuevrability and obsec units. you are not going to win with points...

-even if you face 0 cc threats, and engage in firing competiton, you cannot prevail against true gunlines (tau): a tau gundam army will just rip you apart in a couple of turns of shooting

-moreover, you will suffer a lot from deployment shenanigans: null deployment will f*k you up; you don't have any trick to mess with opponent deployment (barring that awful unmitigated deepstrike that you could try with the grinders...); you don't have enough bodies to prevent infiltrators to munch you from the sides...also, considering that turn 1 charge is a thing...you cannot protect your vehicles from that, as i said above.

this is my pessimistic idea of how will the list do, competitively.... nothing personal

Suggestions to improve the list:
-drop the forgehost
-drop the cultists
-drop the exterminator
-add 5 IW obliterators
-add 40-60 zombies
-add at least 2 artilleries (hertshaker can do)

this will still leave you in the same spot, but with some extra bubblewrap for your tanks and more firepower.

other nice thing you could do is to add LOTS of MSU screamers instead of the forgehost, or add some summoning battery with tzeentch stuff.

But at this point i hope someone else will have better ideas, i'm not reliable at all, i warn you!
GLORY TO CHAOS!

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post #3 of 4 (permalink) Old 01-10-17, 12:45 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you for the reply and the honesty!

I'm not very familiar with what other armies can bring to the table, so it's good to hear from someone with more experience I'll take what you've said into consideration and try and add more mobility to the force whilst also getting rid of some of the unnecessary units.
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post #4 of 4 (permalink) Old 01-10-17, 01:45 PM
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i hope i'm being helpful and not destructive
There is a nice roundown of the top dog lists in here:
Top ITC Tournament Lists November 2016

you should build your list trying (double stress on try...CSM are not in a good position to easily win tourneys anyway) to counter all these lists and their experienced generals.

This is the kind of list that i expect when speaking about tourney level sh*t...
http://bloodofkittens.com/wp-content...aOpen-2016.pdf
pretty dirty if you ask me. (outrageous list, frankly)

also worth mentioning is the full knight list...not a tourney winner, but could catch you flat footed.

sad truth is that chaos will have an hard day trying to win with gunline lists and should also rely on melee (or psy)...with all the relative downsides!
still, as you can see from some of the lists above, renegades and heretics can be a tourney winner list, if properly supported by daemons.
i honestly don't know where the new Traitor legions will bring CSM. we'll see.

see you on the boards!

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Originally Posted by Lux View Post
The calls of Slaneesh stir so deeply within me, as if I was birthed from the very essence of it. For my ambition to infinitely ascend above all is never ending, like fire within it burns me to ever cindering ash. Lord of light and ascension is who I am, realities burn to ash at my very passing. My luminescence is unparalleled for I am luminosity itself, all light is but a shadow of my silhouette
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